How many 5.15b climbers are there?

Ryan Palo wrote: I find it somewhat hard to believe that someone from Boulder who's a mp.com contributor is unaware of 8a. Anyhow, that's pretty tired joke. About as old and lame as a yo-mama joke.

I have only been climbing for 4 months. But I have fallen in love with it and wish to give back to the community. And, sometimes dead horses need a good switchin.

J Q wrote:I wonder why climbing is the one sport where people who totally suck feel compelled to judge people who excel.

Obviously you've never watched the Super Bowl with anyone else. Ever. Ain't nothin' quite as awesome as watching some 300 pound dude double-fisting hot wings and blue cheese dip screaming at a top athlete that he isn't trying hard enough.

Oh yeah, since this is already about .15s I won't make a new post.

But off topic: Why is it that the pros have routes with draws all the way up. But if I ever spy a .14 from the base I never see draws. Do they rap down and place the draws? Or do the more popular routes have the draws left there(if so, how does weather affect wear?)?

Eliot Augusto wrote:Oh yeah, since this is already about .15s I won't make a new post. But off topic: Why is it that the pros have routes with draws all the way up. But if I ever spy a .14 from the base I never see draws. Do they rap down and place the draws? Or do the more popular routes have the draws left there(if so, how does weather affect wear?)?

Not sure if this is what you mean but the pros "have draws all the way up" because most people hang the draws before going for a hard red point (if there aren't fixed draws).

To the second part of your question, lots of sport areas will have fixed draws on hard/steep lines. On really overhanging stuff you can't just rap off and clean the route like you would on something closer to vertical (picture cleaning one of those heinous cave routes on rappel...). And yes those perma draws get fucked up and need to be replaced eventually.

Ryan Watts wrote: Not sure if this is what you mean but the pros "have draws all the way up" because most people hang the draws before going for a hard red point (if there aren't fixed draws). To the second part of your question, lots of sport areas will have fixed draws on hard/steep lines. On really overhanging stuff you can't just rap off and clean the route like you would on something closer to vertical (picture cleaning one of those heinous cave routes on rappel...). And yes those perma draws get fucked up and need to be replaced eventually.

Thanks

Bryan Gilmore wrote:Alex Megos...

... has not climbed a 15b (yet).

yep, flashing 14d and doing 15a don't earn you the 15b merit badge.

David Sahalie wrote:yep, flashing 14d and doing 15a don't earn you the 15b merit badge.

Someone earlier stated that if you've done "Wheel of Life", you've climbed .15b?

Bryan Gilmore wrote: Someone earlier stated that if you've done "Wheel of Life", you've climbed .15b?

Repeating Ryan Palo's response (because apparently no one reads previous posts): WoL goes at 14d (Ethan Pringle) or 15a (others) depending on who you ask.

For those keeping score at home:

Ondra
3 5.15c, one confirmed by Sharma
8 5.15b, four repeats

Sharma
1 5.15c, confirmed by Ondra
6 5.15 b, 3 confirmed by Ondra
Note: I thought Es Pontas was 5.15a?

Andrada
2 5.15b

Midtboe
1 5.15b

Fernadez
1 5.15b (some debate over the send, though the grade has been confirmed)

Rouhling
1 5.15b (done at the time of the potential first 5.15a Open Air, which was only graded 5.15a by Ondra years later. unrepeated. debate over the send and if I recall chipped possibly???)

Two questions

Does a 5.12 in eldo count as 5.15b?

Nope. I guess that's my only question

J Meagher wrote: Yes, Wheel of Life is long, but its not 15b, its V15. What I find interesting is that theres a ton of people who climb V15, and sometimes it doesn't even get any media attention, but 15b, which is approximately the same grade, is exponentially more rare

I'm sorry. Have you climbed WOL?

Let's not comment on routes that we haven't done aight? Let's stick to confirmed grades if we are gonna talk bout grades

J Meagher wrote: Yes, Wheel of Life is long, but its not 15b, its V15. What I find interesting is that theres a ton of people who climb V15, and sometimes it doesn't even get any media attention, but 15b, which is approximately the same grade, is exponentially more rare

The obvious answer is that they are not "approximately the same grade."

As for WoL being V15, the question of where it fits on a boulder scale is a bit less interesting than where it fits on a route scale, since it's the length of a route and has several rests (of varying quality). For example, how does one compare WoL to the 2-move Lucid Dreaming? If our goal is to try to make sense out of grades (an uphill battle, admittedly), we should probably be comparing WoL to routes like Realization, with multiple bouldery cruxes separated by rests or easier climbing.

mozeman wrote: Let's not comment on routes that we haven't done aight?

I love how if everyone did this, the MountainProject forums would implode like a dying star.

Ryan Palo wrote:WOL is either 14d or 15a depending what the athlete needed to sell their sponsor that year.

Wow, that's shocking. Read some of your blog btw. Nice stuff

Paul Hunnicutt wrote:For those keeping score at home: Ondra 3 5.15c, one confirmed by Sharma 8 5.15b, four repeats Sharma 1 5.15c, confirmed by Ondra 6 5.15 b, 3 confirmed by Ondra Note: I thought Es Pontas was 5.15a? Andrada 2 5.15b Midtboe 1 5.15b Fernadez 1 5.15b (some debate over the send, though the grade has been confirmed) Rouhling 1 5.15b (done at the time of the potential first 5.15a Open Air, which was only graded 5.15a by Ondra years later. unrepeated. debate over the send and if I recall chipped possibly???)

i never understood why people need to keep bringing up the past about some of these routes. Fernadez graded the route 5.15c when there was only maybe 4 or 5 5.15a's. it was down graded to 5.15b. Rouhing had done countless routes that have never been repeated. there is also a 5.15a in the same area that was never repeated. Whether it was chipped or not, doesn't matter. that was a different time and era that we can not apply todays ethics on yesteryear's climbs. For me, Fernadez might have over rated his route but Ondra has also down graded many hard routes including two of Americas hardest (last year). Rouhling was and still is one of the hardest climber in the world, for anyone to discredit any of his sends is ridiculous. He went back years later and repeated every move of that route for the camera, linking the crux. I believe Fernadez did the same.
If we question everything that was sent before main stream media made a send 'real', how do we know that Todd Skinner did Salathe or Peter Croft did Moonlight. the internet is full of haters and skeptics. Either take a man for his word or don't, but unless you know for sure, you have no room to talk.
As for those that climb 5.15b...very few. Does it really matter? no one on this post or on MP period does. Go climb and enjoy yourself, the time with your friends and the rock you are on. as for WOL, its a boulder problem, doesn't matter how many moves. If you don't have a rope, its either a boulder or a solo, can't compare it to a sport route.

Rajiv Ayyangar wrote: The obvious answer is that they are not "approximately the same grade." As for WoL being V15, the question of where it fits on a boulder scale is a bit less interesting than where it fits on a route scale, since it's the length of a route and has several rests (of varying quality). For example, how does one compare WoL to the 2-move Lucid Dreaming? If our goal is to try to make sense out of grades (an uphill battle, admittedly), we should probably be comparing WoL to routes like Realization, with multiple bouldery cruxes separated by rests or easier climbing.

Compare the Fly to Jumbo Love

...but why male models?