Thumbs up vs thumbs down

So I am a moderate climber that has always played around with cracks since I started climbing, and have climbed a few here and there, but usually only get to climb one crack for like every 20 sport routes mostly due to climbing partners preference. One of my climbing partners and I have decided to hit the cracks more this upcoming non-snow season (we only get a week of actual summer here) and have been practicing a lot in the indoor gyms. Somebody watching us the other day really criticized us because we jam almost everything thumbs down, which is what I was taught, and which I feel the most comfortable with. The critique was that a true jammer does it thumbs up, which I do thumbs up on bottom hand when doing layback or if the crack wanders laterally, but for straight up and down it just feels really funky. So my question is there really a right way/ wrong way? Or perhaps maybe someone has some insight they would share as to why thumbs up would be advantageous to thumbs down?

I think thumbs up is more natural and comfortable for most people, but I don't think either is right or "wrong." I think both are useful, depending on the crack. Experiment with both, and you'll figure when to use one or the other.

There's no one way to climb a crack that's part of the fun...

To me, a thumbs down jam is more secure, but harder to lock off, i.e., bring into the center of my body as I move up the climb. When hanging off of a jam over my head, thumbs down feels more secure since my weight twists my wrist, torquing the back of my hand against the crack. As I make a move, my ability to pull in this position gets worse and worse the lower my hand gets relative to my torso. Try touching your sternum with your knuckles (vs. with the heel of your hand), it feels really awkward.

A thumbs up karate chop jam doesn't give you the added security of the torque but is way easier to move to the center of your body. As my jamming technique has improved this has felt like a better way to jam and move. Sometimes I'll go into a stable, thumbs down jam to place gear, only to realize once I have it clipped and the fear dies down that I can't move without switching it back to thumbs up.

Climbing with both thumbs down like you said is a personal marker for when I am getting desperate and about to flame out and peel out of the crack.

Give the dude two middle fingers up.

What size crack are you workin on? How comfortable are you in your foot jams?

The problem with learning how to crack climb in the gym or the vertical splitters at a place like IC is that some of the fundamentals can be hard to learn. A lower angled crack with constrictions can teach good technique to a new crack climber as well as help build crack specific muscles for all sizes.

Totally depends on your hand size and the crack texture IMO. Often the lip of the crack will help to determine which jam. In most cases I choose the thumbs up before the thumb down because it is easier for me to hold the same jam longer as I bring my feet up towards my hands. I find it harder to hold a waist level jam thumbs down. ss

tell the douche-nozzle to get on the climb and show you, likely he's talking out of his ass.

As others above have stated above: There is no right or wrong, both versions are useful, and it all depends. In addition to the above factors, note that in constrained or awkward situations (corners, leaners, etc.) you’ll often feel more comfortable and solid with one hand each way – thumbs pointing toward each other – and you’ll naturally move in a shuffling motion. In contrast, for straight forward situations with good jams (ie, splitters) it can be fun to use both hands thumb-up and to move in a crossing motion. Using both hands thumb-down is only occasionally useful for a short move because you have very little mobility. Then there are the off-sized jams such as fat fingers/thin hands and wide hands that change the game….

Don't have time to read all the above, but will lend you my simple analysis in case the point has not been made. Efficiency. Climbing waterfall ice, we made a huge break through about 15 years ago where we achieved a solid 6"-8" efficiency increase with each movement and now it is the exclusively taught and accepted technique.

Shaking hands with the crack should always be your default jam. Counter jams are used when they make sense because you are off center,etc. With your hand straight in, you will make a much higher movement before the next jam vs it being upside down. I will guess 6"-8" and prob more. Like ice climbing, efficiency and finesse (=conservation of energy) of movement are how you improve your rock climbing skills. Good Luck.

Like most things in climbing, it depends.

Size of the crack, size of your hands/fingers, direction of the crack (diagonal or straight in), other features (in a corner/dihedral or straight in splitter).

In general, you can move higher off thumbs up (as mentioned). But sometimes thumbs up won't work because of one if the above. Sometimes it's better to shuffle hands with one thumbs up and one thumbs down. Just climbs bunch of cracks (preferably outdoors) and you'll figure it out.

It makes it very hard to learn when the people that are teaching you don't know what the hell they are talking about.

JLP wrote:Just to clarify, this is a thread about hand jams - the easiest jam for the easiest cracks. Thumbs up or down = just depends, who cares. Next time you see this guy, ask for a demonstration of a thumbs up ring jam.

^^^ +1

Best crack climbing instruction video I've seen.

Just my personal observation:

I find that a thumbs up jam allows me to bring that hand lower and lock off lower, allowing me to reach higher for the next jam. Sometimes thumbs down feels better, but I cannot lock that hand as low as with a thumbs up, so it is sometimes harder to reach higher with the next hand. So all things being equal, I try to use a thumbs up if need to make a long reach with the next hand. YMMV.