Single rope

I have always used a single rope, that's what I was taught with, but as I am starting to get more aggressive with trad climbing, I see lots of half ropes and twin ropes, yet most literature says use single. I can understand why for each, but would like to hear some opinions from those experienced.

Use a single when possible, and doubles or twins where necessary.

William Kramer wrote:I have always used a single rope, that's what I was taught with, but as I am starting to get more aggressive with trad climbing, I see lots of half ropes and twin ropes, yet most literature says use single. I can understand why for each, but would like to hear some opinions from those experienced.

I would go single or twin. Halves can cut down on drag a lot, but they are harder to manage, and they are a bit concerning to catch big whippers on. The main point of twins is to allow to do full 60m raps, or less commonly, for redundancy. If you dont need to do 60m raps, I would stick with the single.

Simple: try before you buy. Climb with some friends who use doubles and twins.

But in summary:
twins = great for long routes with lots of raps. Not very robust. Can't use a mini-trax to simul-climb. light weight. Possibly adds redundancy. Can't use a grigri. Great if the belays are trad with seven pieces and you can't use a cordelette.

double = less drag; need for fewer sling draws; pieces less likely to pull out due to drag or bing pulled in the wrong direction; can bring 2 seconds up at the same time via a direct belay; definitely adds redundancy; heavy. Just possible to use a min-trax to simul-climb occasionally. Harder to sort out at the belay. Great for long raps. Can't use a gri-gri. Easier for a second to use gorilla aid. If there is little gear, so in general only one piece will keep you off the deck at any point and the route goes all over the place, then they really make sense. (e.g. many British routes.) Great if the belays are trad with seven pieces and you can't use a cordelette. Moderate robust.

single = easier to handle at the belay; can't bring up two seconds; doesn't require loads of sling draws; good for simul-climbing; can belay with grigri. A pain if the belays are trad with seven pieces and you don't use a cordelette. Very robust. Better for top roping.

To add a few things to David Coley's excellent summary, doubles (meaning half ropes) make dangerous clips much safer (so much so that they would make sense on some sport climbs) and allow you to place and clip marginal overhead pro without paying a penalty if it blows before you pass it.

Although everyone knows about of eliminating drag on wandering routes, you rarely hear about the ability to arrange protection that simply couldn't be had at all with a single rope (eg two protection points at the same horizontal level, one on either side of the climber, and separated by ten feet). For things like this, doubles open the leaders eyes to protection opportunities that wouldn't be contemplated with a single rope; you can look around more broadly and traverse a little off route for good pro.

Doubles also allow for far better protection for the second on pitches with substantial traverses, and really also for the leader, who doesn't have to skip protection for himself or herself in order to prevent a bad swing for the second.

If the rappel hangs after coming free of the anchor, you still have a rope you can lead on to try to recover the stuck rope (this happened to me a few years ago).

In an emergency, having a pair of independent ropes to work with will usually speed up the self-rescue process and in some cases make things possible that couldn't be done otherwise.

As far as I know, both strands of a pair of half ropes have never been cut in a real-word climbing fall. Given some recent tragedies, this is not a merely hypothetical advantage.

Weight and handling are the drawbacks. The belayer has to be skilled at double-rope handling, otherwise a number of the advantages mentioned above will be illusory. 20 kN mentions concerns about catching big whippers. He doesn't elaborate, but I assume he means holding onto a thin single strand when the load is very high. I think he has a point, and have concluded, at least for myself, that an assisted braking device that is double rope maneuver friendly is the best option.

There is a small learning curve for the leader too; how to clip to keep the strands parallel is not always obvious. Occasionally I've met an otherwise good climber who just can't visualize what to do with two ropes; such folks are better off with singles of course.

Much of the climbing in this country follows straight-up vertical cracks, making half ropes less useful. Obviously, keeping two ropes out of your way on an IC splitter is an annoyance with no upside. But for places with face climbing or cracks that require changing formations or utilizing more than one formation, doubles still have substantial pluses.

" but would like to hear some opinions from those experienced."


Pretty good answers, IMHO.

For me. . .

I use doubles for Ice climbing. Not only is there the extra rope in case of accidental cutting but I alternate hands (when I can) in placing screws, so I like to clip the red rope with right and blue rope with my left it keep the ropes nice and separated during the climb. most of the routes I do are full 60-70 meter pitches and rapping off is easier and faster.

For rock climbing of any style I usually use a single rope. If I need to rappel from a multi-pitch than I carry one of my half ropes in a back pack. Full length raps can really speed up a decent.
But to note, in my area the routes do not wander too bad so rope drag is not much of an issue where I would really want doubles.

Rgold / anyone…

Isn't it true that ropes certified as 1/2 ropes can also be used in twin configuration (both strands clipped to every piece) and that you can switch from 1/2 to twin or twin to half configuration in a pitch? I believe that there was a post on MP that provided some pretty compelling support from a rope manufacturer (Mammut?) that the above is true, but my brief search didn't turn up the thread.

NC Rock Climber wrote:Rgold / anyone… Isn't it true that ropes certified as 1/2 ropes can also be used in twin configuration (both strands clipped to every piece) and that you can switch from 1/2 to twin or twin to half configuration in a pitch? I believe that there was a post on MP that provided some pretty compelling support from a rope manufacturer (Mammut?) that the above is true, but my brief search didn't turn up the thread.

Some doubles are rated as twins. However as far as I'm aware, this only means that they pass the relevant UIAA drop tests for both configurations.

There are other issues, like using them with small carabiners. A pair of 9.1mm "twin" ropes are going to look fat in a small carabiner, and you will need to use normal sized lockers at belays if you clove hitch the stands to the same locker. You might also miss out on the low weight of the twins. E.g. Beal Joker (which is also rated as a single).

Round the other way, if half ropes get as thin as twins (say, 7.7mm), then I'd be concerned about holding a fall on a single strand with a normal belay plate.

Having said that, many climbers have been using half ropes as twins occasionally for many a year, and other using their twins as half ropes (but watch the stretch).

NC Rock Climber wrote:Rgold / anyone… Isn't it true that ropes certified as 1/2 ropes can also be used in twin configuration (both strands clipped to every piece) and that you can switch from 1/2 to twin or twin to half configuration in a pitch? I believe that there was a post on MP that provided some pretty compelling support from a rope manufacturer (Mammut?) that the above is true, but my brief search didn't turn up the thread.

Correct answer: Only if they are certified as a twin as well (most are not).

Real-world answer: I have no problem clipping halves as twins, certified or not, because the impact force is still low enough as to not matter for the applications in which I would clip them as twins. Exceeding 12kN with any rope system managed by a plate belay device is extremely hard if not impossible, even if the impact force rating of the two ropes were to exceed 12kN. Worth noting is that, falling on two halves clipped as twins provide a rougher catch than most ropes (although not all ropes), so keep that in mind if you want to try this technique on tiny wires or something like that.

mountainproject.com/v/doubl…

Found the thread. Read Bearmolesters post about half way down the page. There is a ton of great information there.

Clipping halves as twins that have a half rope impact force of 6KN or less is no worse than falling on a maxim rope ... Most of whom have an 80 kg impact force of >9 kn

Read the link above and my post there

As to half ropes the biggest disadvantages are

- cost ... 150$+ per pop ... Since you needs 2 ita double what u pay for a single

- specialized ... My singles start off as lead ropes, then TRs, then fixed lines for solos, then get donated for hand lines ... And i can get a single cheap for ~100$ ... Halves cost more for each rope alone and you arent using em for TR after generally

- skils required ... I can count on one hand the number of partners i have that i trust belaying with halves ... You need to be spot on with feeding the rope and catching falls ... More so if you dont have an assisted locking device

Weight is fine ... Generally no worse than a single + tag

;)

bearbreeder wrote:I can count on one hand the number of partners i have that i trust belaying with halves ... You need to be spot on with feeding the rope and catching falls ... More so if you dont have an assisted locking device

I alluded to this but it is a critical point worth emphasizing. The belayer has to be fully attentive and has to know what to do.

One of the tricks is for the belayer to watch the ropes directly in front of him or her so as to know exactly which strand needs slack and which has to be taken in. If you watch the leader all the time you'll be taken by surprise repeatedly and probably end up pumping out both ropes rather than just the correct one when the leader is clipping. The leader can help by calling out the color of the rope they are about to clip, but the second should be able to manage perfectly without that help.

If the leader has clipped one strand overhead, then that strand will have to be taken in (until the leader passes the high piece) while the other strand is paid out. Here again the bad or inexperienced belayer ends up paying out both strands, thereby negating some of the value of the leader's high clip.

rgold wrote: I alluded to this but it is a critical point worth emphasizing. The belayer has to be fully attentive and know what to do.

The flipside is that its not hard to train people with twin ropes ... And a person holding twin ropes through and atc guide has quite a bit of friction

So if your partner aint skilled with halves, use them as twins ... Just be aware the impact force will be in the 9-10 kn range .... Same as a maxim single

Hand breaking force on ropes from journal of mountain risk management

bergundsteigen

;)