Adding Bolts between runouts

wow, all that cuz of 2 bolts on a chossy 'tespiece'5.8? Lol

Runner up for best 2014 thread…???

20 Kn said...

I have seen crags closed as a result of too many injuries, and if adding a bolt to a climb would have prevented or prolonged the closure, then add away. Access trumps everything.

Interesting .... what crag was shut down????

What 20kN said…HA try that shit at the Gunks! (Or many other places for that matter.)

It seems we have lost our sense of history and the respect for those that have gone before us. I guess what is needed is a "course" for new climbers talking about what is correct and incorrect behavior on existing routes. Every route is not for every one - if the route is bold and you are not that bold - then climb another route - but don't change that route to suit "you" as others may desire that risk the same way the first ascent party put it up. If you want well protected by "your" standards - then put up "your" own route. There are plenty of routes out there - more than enough that suit you I am sure.

whatever bro-man,

from where i'm sittin, the average 20 year old 5.10 'trad' on this site does nothing but ball-cup the 'stonemaster EB wearing chuff-masters' of the 80s who bravely soloed slab 5.9, forever locking it in as a free-solo. but 5.12? oh, yeah that'll need to be bolted with hooks cuz it is too hard/steep. weak sauce.

Let's add bolts to everything to make it safer for everyone because considering noteworthy feats of ballsiness and mental fortitude isn't something that's worthwhile. As a matter of fact, you can pretty much apply the "disregarding history because it doesn't jive with your viewpoint" philosophy with everything, and the outcome will most likely be positive.

Furthermore, let's equate every opinion from a "tradional support" viewpoint with 5.8 chufflets in their first year of climbing, instead of adopting the perspective of veterans that can climb both 5.13 sport AND hard, runout trad, just to make the sporto wankery standpoint seem more valid.

And while we're at it, let's stop kidding ourselves that the "nothing should be runout because trad guys spray too much but can't climb physically hard stuff and by saying this I'm actually spraying about my own abilities in a somewhat clandestine manner so as not to draw attention to the fact that I'm spraying and validating what I think is right" perspective is lopsided. Clearly, decrying one thing because it is obtuse and supporting the opposite isn't obtuse at all. Fucking silly ass trad assholes. WTF are you thinking?

Perhaps the number one benefit to doing all this is so we won't have to see a one-sided, sarcastic jab from guys like Sahalie because some fat dude wearing too many cams and three sets of hexes beat him up in 1992. Bolts for everyone. I'm buying. We'll start with the BY in Tuolomne. I dare anyone to try to stop me too. I'm bringing my strongest sportos with me and they'll be guarding the first pitch. Fuck you mentalists. Climbing is about being physically strong only.

So you're going to retro-bolt the Bachar-Yerian?

Could someone make an argument against bolting climbs that do not have usable/accessible gear placements adding to the danger intrinsic to climbing without invoking the spirit of the climb, a misguided sense of crag/climb ownership, the fallacy that historical wrongs should be repeated further because they've been repeated previously, or deliberately bastardizing the arguments for bolting these climbs?

EDIT: I don't count insults as arguments, so just to be clear: if you're expecting that lazy argument tactic to somehow side-step the rules of making a coherent point, you should probably reconsider.

shreddy wrote:So you're going to retro-bolt the Bachar-Yerian?

Fuck yeah. Try to stop me. I'll have guys that can climb 5.13d off the couch guarding the first pitch.

I mean who cares about runouts? Runouts are just something to spray about, right Sahalie? Mental fortitude means nothing, and only 5.8 chuffers really care about them. I'm bolting every runout testpiece to prove that sport climbing is superior because strength and physical prowess is the only thing that matters. If you think otherwise, you're just spraying about how bad ass you are when really you need runouts to feel like you did something worthwhile because you can't do hard moves. Right Sahalie? That's pretty much your position. Keeping runouts on ground up routes is archaic and everything should be safe. It's the only way to see who can really crank and who can't- and that's all that really matters.

whoa dude, wipe the froth from your mouth and take a breath

my position regarding runouts is thus:

takes natural pro? obviously leave it alone.

but because 80s lycra dude decided that one bolt on a 5.11 on a slab in Toulomne is what HE needed because his balls are SO HUGE, but then hangs on hooks when climbing actually got hard (5.12 aka today's warm-up) is a double-standard.

People aren't doing these routes for a reason: they suck because the protection level was decided by another human. Many of these routes have NEVER seen a second ascent, even by the likes of Honnold... and we are talking about beautiful lines with features like chickenheads and dykes that can only be looked at and ball-cupped. aka museum pieces.

want scary?: solo, high ball, do long run-outs between natural pro. The ROCK dictates the pucker-factor, not a ego of the FA.

Ben, read my comment from a page ago. I did just that.

I support run out and lead bolted routes. I also think that rap bolted routes with arbitrary run outs should be rebolted from a flow and climbing perspective.

There isn't a disagreement between the two in my mind.

Ben Huber wrote:Could someone make an argument against bolting climbs that do not have usable/accessible gear placements adding to the danger intrinsic to climbing without invoking the spirit of the climb, a misguided sense of crag/climb ownership, the fallacy that historical wrongs should be repeated further because they've been repeated previously, or deliberately bastardizing the arguments for bolting these climbs?

Yes. There are tens of thousands of other routes to be climbed. No one is forcing you to climb that runout. Once you've ticked all those safe climbs at the grade, then come back and complain.

no one forces you to clip bolts either.

David Sahalie wrote:no one forces you to clip bolts either.

Precisely! Let's bolt 'em all! If you want runouts, do it in a contrived way so the guys that really crank don't have to suffer your horrific chuffery. Get 'em Dave!

I could care less if no-second-ascent slabs get bolted or not. It is the ball-cupping of cheaters that I am taking issue with.

David Sahalie wrote:I could care less if no-second-ascent slabs get bolted or not. It is the ball-cupping of cheaters that I am taking issue with.

I understand man lol. But you don't come off that way. Remember tard ninja? You come off as the sporto version of him. You must realize that, and I'm sure you pile on the hyperbole on purpose. I'm just bored and felt like having a little circle jerk. Everyone takes issues with spraying, cheating chuffsters.

btw, it's couldn't care less. If you could care less, that means you care some now.

gotcha, agreed. anything to take the pain of cubicle life away. thanks for the grammar tip

eta: i miss tard ninja. come back bro!

STOP! Do not be nice to each! Fight! Fight! I have the flu and need entertainment!

You'll not be getting off that easily NC. Pick a side and join the circle jerk. Make sure to be as polar as possible. Extra points for sharp, biting sarcasm and vocab deeper than Frank Zappa and the Dalai Lama's love child.