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Adding/moving bolts at Stone Mountain NC

Meme Guy · · Land of Runout Slab · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 325
Emil Briggs wrote: My apologies then. Your comment about chopping bolts to get rid of the gumbies didn't make sense to me though given how conditions actually are at Stone with the gumbies concentrated on the few well protected gear lines. If you climb a lot there then I'm sure we've met sometime and will again in the future. Since you're anonymous and I'm not I can't introduce myself if we do meet but please feel free to do so on your part. I'm a pretty laid back sort of climber and enjoy talking with others even if we don't agree about everything. As far as my idea I don't see it going anywhere now. I may or may not lead OBS in it's current state. But adding a bolt to replace the tree is not worth it if it creates too much dissension. I'm curious though as to why the different treatment of OBS and Strawberry Preserves. The situations would seem to be exactly the same. Of course tradition matters too. It may be that OBS has been a solo route for long enough now that's how the community views it even if it didn't start out that way.
Calm and collected, respectable and quiet different than my approach. I know exactly what you mean about the arch, I was just half joking half serious about the gumbies at Stone. You're right though, they seem to concentrate at the arch.

I was able to do the route both when the tree was there, cuz I'm old as a dinosaur, and without the tree. Now that the tree is gone you just have to keep your whits about you even more so than normal at Stone. I forget who said it to me, one of the old rope guns probably, but they told me as long as I kept high stepping and didn't let fear enter my mind I could send anything at Stone. He said the moment you doubt yourself and freeze is the moment when you'll start to peel.

Yes, I'm anouynomous on here so I can beat my chest louder than I normally would, but I'm sure we will run into each other at Stone sooner or later and you'll find I'm a pretty laid back dude as well. Although I almost always boulder, look for the old dude soloing the north side this winter, or the group where the funny burning smell is wafting from and you should see me. Sorry, just couldn't resist a NC ethics discussion.

My final thoughts, route went up with tree but without modern sticky rubber...now tree is gone but we have crazy super sticky rubber. Maybe a good trade off?
MHLeitch · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2013 · Points: 30

The only thing I would approve of is putting a seed in the rock and growing a tree, no bolts. I've free soloed it a few times and it's a pretty soft 5.11 IMHO.

If meme guy is who I think...he's definitely a good guy and one of us. I'm pretty sure I've bouldered with him a few times. Upon enquiring why entrance crack was such a hated route, his answer was to convince me to free solo it because "placing gear will only fuck your brain up when you get to the runout section". He thought if I just soloed it I wouldn't worry about the crazy runout at the top... Once gaining the tree ledge and realizing I didn't want to down climb he joined me by free soloing dirty crack and then we free soloed great white way. EPIC day.

Meme Guy · · Land of Runout Slab · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 325
MHLeitch wrote:If meme guy is who I think...he's definitely a good guy and one of us.
Yuppp! Shhhhhhhhhh hah! Holler at your fucking boy!
Jonathan Dull · · Boone, NC · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 415
Meme Guy wrote:. Those routes were put up from the fucking ground by bad ass mother fuckers.... Welcome to North Carolina!
I like it Meme Guy!! And I totally agree.

Emil Briggs: I also believe your inquiry is legitimate and reasonable. It's very simple here in North Carolina. Ask the first ascent party for permission and input. We also must not forget the reason some features no longer exist is because of our impact on the environment as climbers; thats a whole different topic and discussion within it's self.

Ask your self this question. Are you willing to put those bolts in on lead? If so, thats awesome. If not, move on.
Emil Briggs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 125

MHLeitch I've only done Entrance Crack once and I said to myself never again. Not because it's runout but because it sucks! I used to solo at Stone pretty regularly and I would usually do U-Slot or Crystal Lizard to get to the Tree Ledge.

Meme Guy that's a good point about the sticky rubber but consider that having led the route while the tree was there you knew you could do the moves when you led it without. That's a big factor. Yes I've soloed sometimes but I've never tried onsight soloing near my limit. (Well at least not on purpose -- it's happened but it was unintentional).

Jonathan I've never been on the line but from below it looks like there are reasonable stances to drill from so yes I would be willing to do that. Not like some of the other routes. I've heard that Thor took a ground fall on Captain Crunch while drilling for example. I would not want to bolt that one on lead.

Ryan Watts · · Bishop, CA · Joined Apr 2013 · Points: 25

I don't live in the south anymore but I wanted to say I think it's very cool how the OP handled this: asking for FA permission, community consensus, etc.

I learned to climb in NC and I was taught NC ethics as just "ethics". Then I moved out west and after some confusion learned that this was not the case. Not saying one or the other is better just think its really cool that traditional or NC ethics or whatever you want to call them are still being preserved somewhere.

shannon stegg · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2013 · Points: 0

I hear ya! When "Laurel Robbins" at Laurel Knob got retro-bolted it was a great loss to the history, and an insult to a man the climb was named after. It was one of the early routes put up by one of my great mentors, Rich Gottlieb. He and Katie Cantwell put up the first three pitches, and I followed Rich when he finished the last two pitches on the complete ascent. It was an amazing feat watching and learning from such a master of the art. Not long ago I noticed another retro-bolt job on one of North Carolinas legend Diff Richie's routes. I wonder if Rich was ever asked if it was ok. In an area where ethics are held higher than the stone we climb on I am forever confused!

Mark Byers · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2011 · Points: 50
rock_fencer wrote: contact the FA'ers...if not leave I would leave it alone. If the FA'ers cant be contact ask Jeep Gaskin, Buddy Price etc... their opinion and heed it.
Also NC state parks generally do not allow adding any new bolts.
shannon stegg · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2013 · Points: 0

So I guess when someone dies or gets hurt from old rusted bolts that have been there for forty years, the N.C. State Park Service will then shut the place down do to safety concerns.

Jonathan Dull · · Boone, NC · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 415
shannon stegg wrote:So I guess when someone dies or gets hurt from old rusted bolts that have been there for forty years, the N.C. State Park Service will then shut the place down do to safety concerns.
Obviously old and unsafe bolts can be replaced. Thats why most the bolts there are in great condition. Remember the whole "climbing is inherently dangerous" stuff. It states it on all your climbing gear.
shannon stegg · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2013 · Points: 0

Exactly! Thats why down here in "Gawga" when we talk to the authorities at our State Parks about maintaining historic routes, we always seem to find new routes in the process.

Russ Keane · · Salt Lake · Joined Feb 2013 · Points: 392

PLEASE someone add a bolt or two to Entrance Crack! I don't own any Big Boys and I don't want to die on a 5.4!!

shannon stegg · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2013 · Points: 0

Then do not climb it!

Meme Guy · · Land of Runout Slab · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 325

Laughing my ass of right now. Bolt entrance crack hahahahahaha! Sack up and lead.

Emil Briggs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 125

No abuse but while Entrance Crack is awkward unpleasant and uncomfortable it's almost impossible to fall out of it. I suppose it's possible that a very large climber could get stuck in it but a bolt wouldn't help with that.

Emil Briggs · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 125

It all comes back to whether or not you would be changing the original character of the route. The bolt on Strawberry Preserves didn't do that. A bolt on Entrance Crack would.

Meme Guy · · Land of Runout Slab · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 325

You want security? Climb in a fucking gym.

Meme Guy · · Land of Runout Slab · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 325
VaGenius wrote:. No bolt will last more than a week on Entrance Crack..
You've got that right! Did I mention I live 10 minutes from the park? Chop chop.
Meme Guy · · Land of Runout Slab · Joined Sep 2013 · Points: 325
SinRopa wrote:I live hours from the place, so if someone bolts it, don't look at me! Where's Russ anyway? He started this whole mess...
I'm about 95% sure his post was sarcasm.
Russ Keane · · Salt Lake · Joined Feb 2013 · Points: 392

Hah- I really did start all this! Clearly I was not (too) serious. I am a traditionally minded climber, and while I love sport climbing, and even mixed routes, it would be silly to go around and put a bolt on all the hard cruxes out there.

But in all honesty, should Entrance Crack really be rated a 5.4? There are 5.11 climbers on this thread who said they won't go back on it. I think it's misleading at that rating. And like it or not, there are tons of "newbies" in this sport who are going to flock to climbs like Great Arch. Someone is seriously going to get hurt. With that amount of run-out, and such a strange off-width crack, it's deserving of something higher.

Sorry to hi-jack a good discussion. Back to your regularly scheduled programming.

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

Southern States
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