Government Shutdown - impacted areas

doligo wrote:According to this Memo from BLM bathrooms and campgrounds will be locked.

God that's awful. I imagine Gear Heads is doing Land Office business on wag bags.

"Good thing I got in and did Standing Rock yesterday, BITCHES! (Republicans that is)"

House to pass Bills to reopen National Parks, etc..

breitbart.com/Big-Governmen…

Will the Democrat controlled Senate crush this bill too?

Any info on secret ways into Joshua Tree (I have a 4x4) or places you can easily walk to would be appreciated. Suggested alternatives appreciated as well around the same distance from San Diego (I know Tahquitz, any others?) We've got a trip planned for this weekend.

I wonder what the patrols are like? You hardly see Park Rangers in the backcountry now a days as it is.

I'm buying a fucking horse & riding into jtree! I'll dye the horse to match the color of the rocks... little patina on the back end. 800,000 federal employees on furlough! im not worried about patrols too far off the road.

Love the horse idea. Just make sure the bolts on the horse are camouflage color.

"[...] another 15 people who provide law enforcement and fire protection will remain on a full- or part-time basis, unpaid [...]"

Source: blog.pe.com/government/2013…

The question is how many of the 15 are law enforcement, and how will they react to not being paid.

Any news from El Rito, NM? I'm planning on heading up there for the weekend. Would be a trip wasted if I got there and wasn't able to climb.

If only this was a real government shut down, or even a USDA shut down, then it would affect the deficit.

Larry S wrote: All depends on who gets to say what's "Essential" government services.

Here, I'll give you a clue.

The Park Service is part of the USDA, but it's only the "non-essential" (not to mention tiny) part of the USDA's trillion dollar budget. Note that if the USDA stopped, say, subsidies for corn, the concerned parties wouldn't gripe about it on the interwebs. They have lobbyists for that, and it would be heard on the House floor. That makes them 'essential'.

Hopefully the shut down lasts long enough that we actually do band together and find ways around it, ultimately removing this political football from Congress.

Travis Haussener wrote:Looking for info about the Creek...it's BLM land so it's...fine?? Just wondering as I'm planning a quick hittin' trip on Saturday to Sunday.

I'm writing this form the Creek (using my cell antenna). Everything is open except the park. Bring TP

Ball wrote:The Park Service is part of the USDA, but it's only the "non-essential" (not to mention tiny) part of the USDA's trillion dollar budget.

NPS is part of the DOI and the USFS is part of the USDA, I think...

Oh, I knew the BLM is part of the DOI (which, sadly, is also considered 'essential') but I didn't know the NPS was, too.

In either case, it doesn't affect the argument. The whole concept of departments and agencies...sorry almost opened a can of worms there.

I like how LEOs are more likely to be considered 'essential'. Just shows the mentality of those in charge.

I know I'm just dreaming here, but what if all parks were to revert to monuments? Ahh...

Is North Table still open? I'm planning a bivy

Let's see...national parks are shut down, but rangers are on site telling people they can't enter the parks and patrolling the trails for violators? Sounds less like a shut-down and more like a shut-out. What a political stunt!

Classic case of government doing too much. Turn the NP system over to private management, and you'll never see a shut-out again. Of course, you'll have to pay for your use, but who wouldn't rather man up and pay his own way than freeloading off some sap of a taxpayer who never ventures past his front door?

Ball wrote: Here, I'll give you a clue. The Park Service is part of the USDA, but it's only the "non-essential" (not to mention tiny) part of the USDA's trillion dollar budget.

Anyone who cites data that is:
A) Incorrect on it's face, and
B) Off by at least one order of magnitude
...shall be criticized, and their arguments otherwise substantially ignored as irrelevant fairy tales.

I'm all for critical examination of spending and of our stupid (insane) farm bills, but this discredits otherwise rational arguments.

Jonny d wrote:Let's see...national parks are shut down, but rangers are on site telling people they can't enter the parks and patrolling the trails for violators? Sounds less like a shut-down and more like a shut-out.

How I feel about national parks in general, whether they be open or not.

Sydney Johnson wrote:Any news from El Rito, NM? I'm planning on heading up there for the weekend. Would be a trip wasted if I got there and wasn't able to climb.

El Rito is Forest Service so it should be open.

In related news, WW2 vets who stormed the beaches of Normandy seemed to have no problem storming the yellow tape

http://thinkprogress.org/security/2013/10/01/2710701/photos-world-war-ii-veterans-force-memorial-honoring-them-open-during-shutdown/

I know nobody wants to hear that there is rational thought into shutting down the national parks and monuments but here you go.

People in those areas means those areas need to be maintained. Those people want facilities, they want support, and all too often they do something stupid that requires attention from rangers. Usually small crap, but if the rangers aren't there the situations escalate and shit gets bad. Hence the closure. And LEO's to enforce said closure.

I don't like it anymore than anyone else (I'm canceling a trip to Devils Tower this weekend) and the reasons to shut these areas down are really not applicable to a great percentage of the climbers who want to use them. However, the govt has neither the time or any kind of reasonable way to say "you can use the parks if you're self sufficient" without opening themselves up to huge liability and a great deal of work...which they can't pay for.

Hate Congress, vote them out, don't get all riled up because your vacation plans get hindered.

The shutdown will only apply to NPS and BLM facilities and NPS properties. USFS lands will be open. State Parks will be open *cough*Shelf Road*cough*.

I am currently looking for alternatives to my J-Tree trip (dammit, I have the best site at Sheeps Pass booked for this weekend).

Has anyone been in the Holcomb Valley or Idyllwild area since yesterday? Is there any impact on access or dispersed camping there?

wonderwoman wrote: I'd be happy to pay the entrance fee to the park. Now I guess I get to climb for free. Regardless, the Affordable Care Act will move forward and is not contributing to the deficit.

HuH??

Does this include the Brainard or any IPW areas? I've heard different stuff on this so I'm wondering if anyone has some clear cut info since they aren't national parks.

I'm assuming there should be no impact other than triple the length of the drive.