The Flatirons post-flood

The governor said he estimates 1.5 billion to fix the state. The OSMP just wanted part of that.

Doesn't matter if it's only $10k worth of bridge materials and three weeks worth of volunteers. We can call that 17 million.

I would like to think that we're way past the $5000 staplers that the govt is well known for. We're not.

Greg D wrote: Give a private contractor a chance to fix them and it will be done faster, better and for less. News flash. Inefficiencies aren't cheap.

Riiiight. Ha ha. I love it. Private enterprise is always more efficient and competent than those stupid, slothful, inefficient government employees. What a load of crap. The more accurate statement is probably that most people, government or private, could stand to be better at what they do. For every inefficient government entity or worker that you can find, I will guarantee that I can match it with a private sector employee. Nice try though.

Mike Lane wrote: Yeah, but its open space; not the city itself. Trails, some foot bridges, benches.... I'm interested in seeing an account of how the hell it got up to $17M.

Yeah, I hear you. I would be interested to know why it cost so much to fix this stuff up.

OSMP uses private contractors. They had one working at Chautauqua just before the flood.

In case you missed the announcement on the OSMP web site, the First Flatiron has reopened to climbing.

I was there in the afternoon. Here's a short report.

There is extensive damage to the Chautauqua trail and to the Bluebell "trail" (the paved road to the Bluebell Shelter). Above the Bluebell-Baird trail, though, I hardly saw any signs of mayhem. This makes me hopeful that the approach to the Third may also be in passable conditions.

If you go up to the Shelter and then turn right on Bluebell-Baird, you can reach the First avoiding all the mud. I went up Baker's Way and North Arête. I didn't notice any instability or change. The steps at the base of the Direct East Face and the starts of Fandango and Baker's Way were also in good conditions.

J. Albers wrote:Private enterprise is always more efficient and competent than those stupid, slothful, inefficient government employees.

J. Albers wrote:Yeah, I hear you. I would be interested to know why it cost so much to fix this stuff up.

Don't look now, but you already answered your own question.

I don't believe it's the gov't employees that are in the trenches that are as you describe them, rather the people in charge of allocating the money.

There were people on 2nd and 3rd this weekend. Only 1st is currently open. Not that I agree with the closures, don't be an asshole and ruin it for everyone by not respecting them.

fossana wrote:There were people on 2nd and 3rd this weekend. Only 1st is currently open. Not that I agree with the closures, don't be an asshole and ruin it for everyone by not respecting them.

Sooo. You think that posting this, dimeing out your fellow climber is going to help the situation out? How about just keeping your mouth shut, or are you some type of authority figure over the flatirons? Think not.

Ya, maybe those climbers shouldent have been climbing those flatirons, but do you really think OSMP is going to keep them closed longer because of one or two parties violating the closure? Most likely if your caught , you'll be fined. Case closed. Not your problem.... I doubt the'll be a mass punishment handed out because one or two people violated the closures.

J1. wrote: How about just keeping your mouth shut, or are you some type of authority figure over the flatirons? Think not.

How about you go back to kindergarten and learn how not to be a d*ck for no reason. Sheesh. Grow up.

Lol... Good one..

J1. wrote:= Ya, maybe those climbers shouldent have been climbing those flatirons, but do you really think OSMP is going to keep them closed longer because of one or two parties violating the closure? Most likely if your caught , you'll be fined. Case closed. Not your problem.... I doubt the'll be a mass punishment handed out because one or two people violated the closures.

The point is that people before you have worked to maintain climbing access to all the affected areas. People disregarding closures is bad juju, creating a poor impression of climbers in the eyes of land managers. Those impressions add up. There is no reason to do such except being impatient jerks. Climbers calling other climbers out on being selfish asshats is what we do because we care about maintain access to climbing areas which requires staying on good terms with those in charge.

On the other hand, damn OSMP open more stuff up and make it easier to find open/closed space on your site.

Good point.

Maybe I was a bit harsh in my original post , but posting up on a climbing forum that you witnessed people breaking the regulations may not be such a good idea if we want these other flatirons to open.

I know its a long shot but you never know who could be reading these threads.

J1. wrote: I know its a long shot but you never know who could be reading these threads.

Probably not a long shot.

I agree it's better not to publicly pinpoint closure violations.

Even better NOT to blatantly and visibly violate closures.

The latter is pretty darn thoughtless.

PS Brenta, thanks for the report!

Mark E Dixon wrote:I agree it's better not to publicly pinpoint closure violations.

The rangers were patrolling the trails on Sun at least in the afternoon. I doubt anyone went under the radar during that time.

Greg D wrote: News flash. Climber access trails are dirt and rock and a bit rough. After the flood, the trails are... well... dirt and rock and a bit rough. . Same as a million years ago. Give a private contractor a chance to fix them and it will be done faster, better and for less. News flash. Inefficiencies aren't cheap.

"So... nature must be made 'safe' for us by governmental agencies?
What a load! "

+2, I cringe at the thought of the government assuming they know whats best for the enviroment and those who use it.

See what happens when climbers can't climb?

They all get grumpy…And take the law into there own hands!

Cor wrote:See what happens when climbers can't climb? They all get grumpy…And take the law into there own hands!

Do you see what happens Larry! Do you see what happens Larry, when climbers have to drive more than 2 hours to climb decent vertical rock..

Look out the window Larry!!

Matt Thaner wrote: "So... nature must be made 'safe' for us by governmental agencies? What a load! " +2, I cringe at the thought of the government assuming they know whats best for the enviroment and those who use it.

Yeah, that is best left to oil and mining companies. :)

Yeah! Oil and gas should manage the land! They would do a way better job of efficiently opening trails than this inefficient bureaucracy! There's a ton of profit to be made in conservation and off of climbing bums.
Privatize Open Space!

The First Flatiron is open for climbing.

Flatirons land manager, City of Boulder-OSMP, has assessed all designated trails in the system but needs to assess climbing-access trails. A group of approx 10 volunteer climbers will gather data and images beginning next week for OSMP’s assessment needs. Once OSMP reviews all the data the FCC, with input from the climbing community, will provide suggestions as to priorities.

Although climbing-access trails may get a clean bill, the larger, designated trails below them may need restoration before OSMP allows access.

We’re building a volunteer-list so when the call comes, we’ll be ready with trailworkers. If you're interested please send an email to news@flatironsclimbing.org with 'volunteer' in the subject line.

OSMP understands our frustration and that this is a great time of the year to be in the Flatirons – raptor closures are lifted and the temps are right. They’re working feverishly to restore access.