Some Adirondacks High Peaks Questions

Planning a long weekend in the Dacks at the end of September and trying to decide whether to do Diagonal and maybe even Arch Madness at Wallface or possibly check out some of the climbs at Avalanche Lake, in particular California Flake. Never been to either spot and curious what people would recommend.

I've seen a lot of info on here on Diagonal already. Tentatively planning to hike in afternoon, camp at Summit Rock, do Diagonal morning and time permitting Arch Madness. What do people think of Arch Madness? I see the pro is very good per the book.

For Avalanche Lake I imagine we could manage California Flake as a day trip or camp at Avalanche Camp and do a few nice climbs over 2 days. Big question here - how sketchy is the fixed pro on California Flake? I'm not comfortable with long runouts on 5.9 trad. And are some of the other climbs on the lake worth sticking around for?

Appreciate any advice. Thanks!

Yours,
Logan

I assume you have some backcountry hiking and camping experience? This is real deal wilderness. [I assume nothing on the intrawebs]

You will want to bring a bear can for both places. Bears WILL get your food otherwise, it's a roll of the dice whether a bear checks your camp on any particular night but they roam from camp to camp at night. That's what bears do in their spare time, which is pretty much all their time.

I've only done the Diagonal. Took us the better part of the day, you may not have enough time to do two multipitch climbs. Especially if there's other parties on the climb holding things up (in particular on the last two pitches where there's no way around them). A real early start would likely avoid this situation and increase your odds of getting two climbs in.

The climbing at Avalanche Lake is supposed to be some of the best in the park. Can't speak on the quality of the fixed gear though.

Thanks Kevin! We have a bear canister and have heard the stories. I don't have much backcountry experience but my partner is more experienced. Have a water filter, know no fires, etc. Will let you know how Avalanche Lake is if we make it out there. Surprised California Flake isn't listed on here given that it gets 5 stars in the book.

Logan Schiff wrote:Will let you know how Avalanche Lake is if we make it out there. Surprised California Flake isn't listed on here given that it gets 5 stars in the book.

I don't think it gets climbed much. Long approaches like that tend to ward off the hoards.

The Diagonal wasn't on MP either until I added it. Go figure.

Only additional advice would be to watch the weather forecast. Subtract a few degrees from the Lake Placid forecast lows. It can get real cold at night that time of the year, and yes SNOW is even possible (though it doesn't stay around for long).

Peak autumn foliage though!

FYI rockfall on California flake has upped the difficulty a tad to 5.10a.

The avalanche lake leanto is very nice and if your back there you must do the trap dike.

Tough call. Both places are awesome, both can be done as either a day trip or overnight. There are pros and cons to each approach but I would consider Avy Pass a day trip unless you're trying to get in two days of climbing.

Lots of info out there on Diagonal. If you're looking to link it up with another route check out No Mans A Pilot, which is way better than it looks from the Diagonal ramp. Two raps from the top brings you back to the base of the ramp and you can continue up Diagonal.

The first pitch of Arch Madness is excellent and even though they wander the upper pitches are good too. Any runouts on this route are on easier terrain. You can also continue up Wandering Wizard, which is totally worthwhile and will get better with more traffic.

California Flake is a classic. Although some might think the first pitch is a little runout the climbing is secure, and not particularly stout for Adirondack 5.9. As far as sketchy goes, well they are fixed pins although the only really bad one is easily backed up. The rockfall scar is obvious on P2 but having done the route both before and after I do not think an upgrade to 5.10a is warranted.

There is no shortage of good climbing in Avalanche Pass ranging from the Trap Dike (4th class) to stout 5.11. Check the book and the Adirondack Rock website. Shoot me a message if you have any other questions.

I've heard they are writing tickets to people w/out bear canisters... Just throwin' that out there... :)

dec.ny.gov/animals/7512.html

And yep, I guess they can...

Thanks for the helpful advice all! I assume the Avalanche Lake leanto is pretty easy to find? I don't think I saw anything in the book about that.

One other bit of advice, if a bear doesn't get your food at night, the American (Pine) Marten's do a great job shredding packs to get to your food. They can destroy a pack if you wander off for a few minutes and leave it lying about.

Logan Schiff wrote:Thanks for the helpful advice all! I assume the Avalanche Lake leanto is pretty easy to find? I don't think I saw anything in the book about that.

Last time I was there (sadly been a few years) it was right along the trail/easy to find. Most lean-tos that are off trail have signs pointing the way.

Definitely heed everyone's advice about bringing a bear can. Follow the basics about using it (ANYTHING that smells like food or fragrance should be put in it - soap, toothpaste, deodorant, etc). They associate the (assumed unrelated) smells with food, and while your pack may not have food in it, that won't stop a hungry bear or critter from tearing it apart if they smell something they've found alongside food in the pack before. Especially now that there's a smaller supply with fewer dummies inadvertently feeding them.

There is no Avalanche Lake lean-to. The is a lean-to called the Avalanche Camp lean-to that is located roughly halfway between Marcy Dam and Avalanche Lake. It is just below the very steep climb up to the top of Avalanche Pass (Lots of "Avalanche" named locations here and none are the same place) I would take MaxSufferings advice about making it a day trip or if you are thinking about camping at a lean-to and going in from the ADK Loj, going up to Avalanche Lake and then past it and heading to Lake Colden. Several lean-to's there and although you are farther away from the car/trailhead, the trek to and from the climbing and your lean-to is basically flat and easy going. Hiking in to climb at Avalanche Lake then hiking down to camp at Avalanche Camp and then hiking back up to the Lake for another day of climbing is a lot of extra work.

I recently hiked through Avalanche Pass with my wife-- this was in mid-August. Though it will take a few hours the hike is pretty level and surprisingly easy (from Marcy Dam), plus the location is gorgeous. The wall with California Flake on it is to the left just where you enter the pass.

I might want some more beta about current conditions before trooping in to climb there, however. It has been a wet year and when I hiked through, the whole wall with California Flake on it was soaking wet. I don't believe it had rained the previous evening! Maybe since then it has dried out a bit, but I might like to hear from someone who has recently been there about the conditions.

Never done the California Flake, but I definitely recommend both Indian Pass and Avalanche Pass as day trips...totally doable! Lots of easy car camping back in KV and Placid too. But that's just me, either way would be cool. Diagonal took us most of the day, but could definitely be done much faster (all but the last 2 pitches are very easy)

California Lake was dry this past Saturday, 9-7 even though it had rained a bunch here the previous week. When I ran through the pass the previous Tuesday it was running with water... for what it's worth.

Also, there are good tent sites on the south end of Avalanche Lake. Continue as if heading to Lake Colden and look for the trail on your left (east). Camping here makes spending two days climbing in the pass more reasonable.

For those interested, ended up doing a little climbing Saturday (the El, which was awesome), nice lunch at ADK Cafe and then hiked in to Wallface via the Adirondack Loj and camped out, enjoying the quiet and beautiful location. We got a bit of a lazy start Sunday and by the time we got to Diagonal there were already two parties ahead of us and soon thereafter another party behind us who wanted to simulclimb the first 5 pitches, and whom we ultimately let pass us since they were a lot faster.

Anyway, the climbing was lots of fun (honestly a soft fun 8 in my opinion other than one move), weather perfect, and views and foliage spectacular. We probably reached the top some time shortly after 4pm. Was eagerly looking forward to another great day of more sustained climbing (took a long weekend) as we began the 4 raps.

I don't know whether I was distracted, stupid, too inexperienced, or what, but on the second rappel I managed to pendulum into a dihedral, picking up a good amount of speed. Tried to get my feet out in front but instead smashed my whole left side, shoulder, hip and head hard into the wall, resulting in a relatively minor shoulder dislocation and a lot of painful bruising on the hip and leg. Managed to get to the anchor despite a lot pf pain, and we used a rescue spider to rap the next two pitches, one of which had a lot of ledges and was excruciating.

When we finally made it to the base we ran into the party that had passed us. They had tried the walk-off, which they said was awful and took forever. They were nice enough to hike both of our ropes back out for us and gave me a bunch of Advil (I had some in my pack too but was a bit out of it). I was tempted to make the easier hike with them back to Upper Works, but realized it would have been a huge pain for them and a logistical nightmare meeting up with my partner and dealing with our stuff, so instead my partner and I made the long slow trudge out to the Loj.

Thankfully I was able to carry a good amount of our stuff on my right shoulder, but we ended up leaving the bear canister behind with a note saying it's free for anyone who wants it. It's at the Summit Rock campsite. Seven hours or so later we made it to the car. Good news was that there was no wait at the Lake Placid ER and they were incredibly nice. Bad news is that I will miss the great fall climbing weather, and my wife is due to give birth to our first child in April so this all may put a real damper on many of my grander climbing plans. I've only been climbing for about 3.5/4 years, mostly in the Gunks, and obviously have a lot to learn, as this accident illustrates.

Posting two photos below, which may illustrate how I ended up smashing into the wall. I guess the rope landed up a few feet to the right of the natural rap line, and when I lowered off the ledge I swung pretty fast into the dihedral for about 10 feet or so. I know it's entirely my fault, was stupid, unprepared, etc.

I'm very sorry to hear of your injury. I hope you have a full and speedy recovery. Don't be too hard on yourself. You are safe and got yourself out of there, that's what counts.

SethG wrote:I'm very sorry to hear of your injury. I hope you have a full and speedy recovery. Don't be too hard on yourself. You are safe and got yourself out of there, that's what counts.

+1

And thanks for sharing your experience so we can all share in the learning process.

I second Seth on that as well.

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