Another rockfall on Cannon
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Went to Cannon yesterday to do Moby Grape. It was cold and too wet for me so we bailed after the roof. (A bolted anchor on this choss pile ledge would be nice). We then walked down the cliff to Slow and Easy. Huge rockfall has occurred all along the big wall section. The entire cliff base is a war zone and there are scars on most routes. We climbed slow and easy and the anchor was intact but loose gravel and debris made the top out interesting. |
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Climbed there today. The rockfall is pretty scary. There is no trees left standing from SSS to Slow and Easy. Sticky Fingers has some scars that make for new or changed holds I think, but nothing major. There is fine dust all over SF, making it nearly impossible to climb, for me. |
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Vertigo existing anchors need replaceing but Moby should NEVER get bolted belays added to it. So few climbs like that left where you actually have to think about where and how you will make belay and also commit to going for the top or loseing a bunch of $$$ bailing.. I am no bolt hateing trad wanker BTW and have put up a bunch of spurt climbs. Strongly feel that Moby is not the place for that. |
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I would only want to bolt that one belay. (above the roof). There is nothing solid on that ledge, just a pile of that brown rubble that we know is rotten. There is also a long history of a pin station with a bunch of tat. Why not get something reliable in the solid slab and try to keep people off of the rotten stuff as much as possible? |
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Because it drasticly changes the charecter of the climb. The way it is now as soon as you launch above the first bolted belay you have to make all your own decisions about where and how to make belays. You have to make the decision to go up and beat the weather or risk loseing Booty bailing. Personaly I have only belayed at that crap ledge once. Your right it is a crap belay spot. Use all that experience that you have to choose a better one;) Didn't Sprague once say that the reason it was Ok that you wear a helmet is because your smart enough that you have something to protect:) |
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no need to bolt anchors on moby grape its been climbed since the 70's just the way it is..... Let it stay that way.... |
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I have been doing the route for 25 years. In all that time there has been a fixed pin/wired nut/mank anchor at pitch 3. (above the roof). Why is a safe/reliable bolted anchor there worse than the pins? I find it puzzling that pins (which scar the rock and can't be camouflaged in later years} are ok, but bolts, which can be removed and hidden at a later date, are not. |
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I'm with you on this. But obviously we can't have a reasonable discussion about bolts. |
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It seems like Nick has found a very clean and efficient way to ascend the route in question w/o even stopping for a belay "above the roof," let alone needing bolts there. If he (and probably countless others) can do it, why can't everyone? |
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Just because there was a bad anchor in a poor spot does not mean that we should upgrade to a great anchor if that changes the charecter of the climb in a negative way. (see the gunks) the anchor sucked and the gear sucked on that ledge but there are pleanty of other options to find good belays. (I figured that out on my 2nd trip up the Grape) That anchor was never a great retrete anchor so upgradeing it would change the charecter of the climb. Obviously YMMV |
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Bolts are 100% better than pins, tat and mank however in this situation I would be more inclined to vote for cleaning all the mank rather than upgradeing that anchor. |
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Nick, How far above the "by the book" anchor do you go. I can't remember what is right above that right facing dihedral. You can't link P3 an P4 from below the triangle roof to the sickle can you? There must be a lower stance you use. |
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I link P3 and 4 to the base of the sickle. Cruise right by the slow guys who spent 30 min trying to beef up the mank anchor. Done the linkup about a dozen times w/ 60 m ropes. Pretty certain I have also done it with 50m ropes. Pulled at least 3 passes there. I have friends who run P2 through the Triangle roof and belay at a small stance w/ good gear right above the triangle roof. The guides do this as well so that they can hoist the clients over the roof.. |
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Some pics of the base of Slow and Easy. New large blocks behind climbers. |
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Another alternative to belaying on the loose ledge suggested by the guidebook: |
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I've climbed the Grape once. I think Nick makes a lot of sense. |
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I onsighted every pitch of Moby Grape with double ropes and, when I saw the options for an anchor after the roof, just kept going around the loose (and wet) shit to the Sickle. |
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I suppose it does not matter too much since no one here really has the right to toss bolts on this anyhow.... |
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A climber told me he saw evidence of recent rockfall near the base of Moby too. I don't think he was confusing this with the destruction at the base of Slow and Easy, but maybe. Anyone else been up there since Oct 13? |
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My partner and I walked the base today on our way to our route. It looked like the fall happened from above Duet buttress and the rock fall was split on either side of the buttress. Most of the destruction was lookers right, or right beneath sticky fingers, but there was also some fresh talus on the left hand side of the buttress. |