looking for suggestions: med-sized pack built to handle extra weight- OPINIONS ON MAMMUT/MH BAGS?

Variant

Seriously, do not pass go, do not collect $20, get the Variant 37L, literally the only pack I've used that would fit the bill for you in an elegant and durable fashion

I'd be skeptical if Deuter claims the dimensions of both are the same. The 45L feels longer, but the strap system compresses nicely in both.

It will never be as great to climb with as something like a small Cilogear Worksac (I own a 20L and shove it in the bottom for times when I need something better to climb with). But if you're not climbing anywhere near your limit, climbing chimneys or anything else requiring awkward upper body movement it gets the job done. Definitely a bit stiffer in the back and hips than something like a Cilogear pack, but that's the tradeoff between feeling good carrying 40+ lbs and climbing well. I own the 75L Cilogear and have borrowed the 45L one and they're great to climb in, but not so great in carrying heavy loads department. Since I'd take comfort and ability to climb easy stuff the Deuter won, if I were capable of climbing hard technical routes and could suffer a less than comfortable approach then I'd go Cilo.

willeslinger wrote: Seriously, do not pass go, do not collect $20, get the Variant 37L, literally the only pack I've used that would fit the bill for you in an elegant and durable fashion

The Variant probably fits the OP's list the best. However, while the Variant is very well made with a ton of features it is also heavy, bulky, and fiddly. I have a new model Speed 40 that I have been using a lot since last year and it does a lot of things better than the Variant but is not as durable. I have climbed alpine rock and alpine ice with the Speed and it climbs very well. The Speed 30/40 doesn't carry weight very well though and has no provisions for skis (which would shred the sides anyway. Put more than 30lbs in the Speed 30/40 and you're going to feel it.

Of all the packs listed in this thread I would look at the Variant, Epic, Speed 30/40, Mammut Trion, or something from CCW. The Deuter looks like a features and benefits checklist REI pack and Cilo has far too many horror stories.

FWIW I think a do-it-all pack sucks and just means you get to spend all year with a pack that doesn't do anything well.

MH trad pack. Mine does all of those things. Just don't get the black one.

I was looking to buy either the Mountain Hardware Directissima 46 or the Trion Guide and ordered the MHW first.

Out of the box I thought it felt heavier than the 3lb 12oz stated in the specs, but I never weighed it myself.
The drawstring at the skirt of the main compartment caught the fabric which impeded opening and closing.
Personally, I was not fond of the tool attatchment set-up.

Returned this bag to the store and ordered the 3lb 11oz Trion.

Out of the box the Trion weighed noticeably lighter than the MHW.
My only item of complaint with the Trion is that the shoulder adjusting straps are a clamp-lock mechanism versus the traditional slider /friction buckles.
This makes on the fly adjustments difficult, but once dialed in there is no slipping under load.

This pack will carry anything you stuff in it or lash to it regardless of weight.

Thanks for all of the beta, keep it coming- especially opinions on the mammut bags (or other bags you feel are superior).

I take it no one has owned a MH via rapida 35? The MH trad pack doesn't appear on the website so have they discontinued it? Was the trad replaced by the via rapida?

One question that I had for the people using the BD speed or gregory alpinisto was how they found the ice tool attachment, especially if you have a longer glacier ax that doesn't have a hole in the head. Do they feel durable? Any problems? Are they easy to clip on in a secure way?

The Hyperlite Mountain Gear packs have internal stays and padding for right at two pounds. The Ice Pack comes in 2400 (~40 liter) and 3400 cubic inch versions. Kind of pricey, but compared to something like a dyneema pack from Cilogear, they are a steal. My 2400 Ice Pack has carried 35 pounds easily, and it felt fine on my back. The stock crampon attachment bungees could be better, but that is a small criticism. The only feature missing that you requested is a lid. But the new ones do come with a small pocket inside at the top for things like keys, headlamp, whatever.

I haven't seen the 3400 version (55 liters), but it looks like it's basically the same thing made taller with beefier padding.

HMG Ice Pack 2400

I have the Mammut Trion Guide, as well, and absolutely love this pack. I find it carries weight very well (and I'm no hardman). People claim the Cilogear packs are very comfortable. I have a 70L Worksack and I do not find it very comfortable. I think you need to be a hardman to find Cilo packs comfortable.

I typically use the Trion on winter/spring single day ice and rock routes and have used it for a two-night technical climbing trip in the Tetons. You can fit a ton of gear in this pack.

With that said, I wish it had a built-in foam bivy pad and removable lid. But those are only complaints.

IanWarrington wrote:One question that I had for the people using the BD speed or gregory alpinisto was how they found the ice tool attachment, especially if you have a longer glacier ax that doesn't have a hole in the head.

My buddy has on the newer BD Speed packs and he likes it a lot. Very nice pack as well. The ice tool attachment works very well for technical ice tools, unfortunately I haven't seen him carry a standard, straight-shaft mountaineering ax yet.

Arc'teryx NoZone 35. Light, burly, 2 removable stays that will support heavier loads. While not ski specific, skis can be carried a-frame with the compression straps. A small wand pocket works for trekking poles as well. Simplified tool attachment works for traditional, as well as modern "aggressive" ice tools. While on the small side of the volumes, it has a large overflow collar and floating lid. The only drawback when carrying heavier loads is the webbing hip belt. It climbs extremely well and can be stripped down to a bullet style leader pack. So if you have the skrilla, I highly recommend it.

I have the Winter 2012 Alpinisto 35L, size medium, and here are my two cents on the tool attachments ( I'm 5'10" and 164 pounds ):

I don't have a general mountaineering axe, so I can't speak on its behalf, but I do have Nomics and they are what I attached to this pack all this past winter. To be honest, they are a pain in the ass to secure.

Maybe it's just me or maybe it's the design of the Nomics, but I found them difficult at best to secure while inside and damn near impossible while outside with freezing fingers and considering time management. The "dongles" Gregory uses are a bit long and it takes a good "fight" to get them through the small holes on the head of my Nomics.

Since this is a bit of a review, the crampon pouch, which I LOVE, needs to be a bit deeper and a smidge wider. Trying to stuff my snowy, cold Petzl Lynx into them, again with cold fingers, isn't particularly enchanting. The pack needs a floating lid, too. Why Gregory attached the lid is beyond me. Maybe to save a little weight?

Hope this helps.

Christopher: Thank you so much for your review. When I found the aplinisto in a store last year I was initially impressed with the appearance of the pack. I then was disappointed in the non-removable lid and finally wrote it off due to the tool attachment. People on this thread were so complementary however that I was starting to think that I should reconsider it. If you feel the way you do about the pack using it with the tools it was designed for, then I don't have a desire to drop that sort of coin for a pack that just does just some of the things right.

Question to anyone who has been involved in pack design in the past or present: Can you explain to me why high quality alpine packs with a lid design don't all come with a removable lid? Weight difference seams like it would be pretty negligible but there must be some reason that I'm just not seeing? From this thread it suggests that I'm not the only consumer who values being able to take the top off...

I have a cilogear 45L guide service. Sounds like it might be what your looking for. It's not listed on their website but is a model they sometimes make as a special order. I scored and got in on one. It's a normal 45L worksack with wand pockets on the sides that will hold skis/water bottles, crampon pocket, and a bit more durable material on the bottom.

I love this pack. Carries great and climbs great. I find it very comfortable, even with heavier loads. You have to get used to packing it a bit different that you might be used to, but once you learn how to distribute the weight (cilogear website has great tutorial video), the pack becomes one with your body and you wont even notice its there. I love the adjustability and the fact that I can strip it for summit day. And the removable waist strap is a huge plus when climbing.

BD Epic 45

Can recommend the Mammut Trion Light (40l) as a good option. I have used it for multi-day hikes, multipitch trad rock and ice routes. The build quality is bomber. Lots of great features too to give it versatility. Removable inside waterproof sack, support frame, hip belt, lid all making it super light. Good straps and compression and even has ski carry option. Can also take overloading in both volume and weight quite well with good load supporting.

LIV wrote:+1 for the Mammut Trion Guide. Finally found a women specific which is shorter in the torso length. Go big or go small in it ... Adjustable with lots of features.

I bought a Trea Guide 40+7 for a trip to the Tetons. One of the load-lifter buckles broke before I got to the trailhead. Bummed. I also didn't like the fact that the lid is not removable (was going to do surgery on it to fix this). Going to ship it back. If the BD Speed 40 had a back pocket, I'd get it instead.