looking for suggestions: med-sized pack built to handle extra weight- OPINIONS ON MAMMUT/MH BAGS?

Ok, wise sensei of MP:

I'm looking for a quiver-of-one, ~30-35L pack and wanted to find out what people on here recommended: The biggest aspect that I would like it to possess is the ability to be able to load it down (add a rope on the top, a trad rack inside, skis to the sides, alpine boots, tools, helmet, snow pickets tied on- maybe not all on the same trip) and it have the suspension/hip belt/frame to remain comfortable when doing elevation change intense approaches. I want something that I can stretch out and tie onto, to carry all my gear on the 4000 ft vertical approach before we hit the climbing and then can compress down to a negligible day pack when I am crimping up a climb.

Additional features include: top loading, tall narrow shape, great compression straps, floating or preferably removable lid, rope strap, 2 ice tool loops, at least 1 external pocket, 2 is better, ability to attach skis to the sides.

Other gravy features would include lightness, breathability, a pocket big enough to hold a nalgene, and pocket to have avi shovel on the outside, but these are just in a perfect world.

I plan on using this for day hikes/scrambles, single day alpine climbing objectives, ski touring, and solo multiday lightweight backpacking.

Right now the BD boost, speed 30, epic 35, osprey varient 37, and MH via rapida 35 all cover some of the features that I would like, as well as the Boreas lost coast 30, and cliogear worksack 30 which I have no personal experience with.

So wise, wise world of MP- tell me what you would recommend to still be comfortable with 45+ lbs in it and which bags would fold like a cheap lawn chair if you stuffed them to the gills? Other suggestions of bags/companies that I have never heard of? Impart your knowledge...

Have you taken a look at the Deuter Guide series? the 35+ might check most of the boxes you're looking at.

I would look at the Cilo 40b or 45l worksack. The 40b has an external crampon pocket that can carry a water bottle. Or you can just get extra pockets to attach to the straps like I do. Cilo makes a shovel pocket for avi shovel that will also hold a probe. The ski carry strap let's u carry skis diagonal or a frame. The shovel pocket and ski carry strap make the cilos good ski packs. Big expansion sleeve for big loads. Best thing about the pack is that it strips down very easily for summit days or hard climbing. They even make a hip belt with removable padding for their haully packs, u can get it as an extra with their others. Cilo also makes a 30:30 and 30 that r a bit smaller but I would reccomended against them for heavy loads as their frame is just a piece of foam. The 40b and 45l have a foam plastic metal frame that carries heavy loads well. U can easily remove the plastic/metal if u want to go with just the foam to lighten the pack.

My 45l has plenty of room for climbing and camping gear for multiple days. I could go for a week backpacking light in the summer. If u need to carry a bear canister, u will have to carry it on the outside or get the 60l.

I have a Cilo 30l worksack for sale cheap if u r interested.

See if you can find a used Black Diamond Ice pack. Awesome multifunctional pack. Don't know why they quit making that one.

I have the Gregory Alpinisto 50 and I've been really happy with it. I use it for ice, alpine climbing, trad cragging and back country skiing. The fit is good and it caries well even when packed full of heavy gear. I checked out all the major companies packs at Outdoor Retailers last year and while I'd say they were all good packs this is the one I liked the most. The only gripe I have with it is the topnock is not easily removable, but then again most packs of this size have that problem.

They do have a 35L also but personally I don't care for a 35L pack, the 50L only weighs 4oz more than the 35L (on the Alpinisto) and it holds a lot more. You can always put less in a bigger pack and compress it down. The 50L also has a couple of features the 35L doesn't.

Jonny d wrote:See if you can find a used Black Diamond Ice pack. Awesome multifunctional pack. Don't know why they quit making that one.

I had the BD Ice Pack and it was the most uncomfortable pack I ever carried. It's possible it just didn't fit my body type but if I had more than 20lbs in the pack it hurt like hell after a couple miles. Just my $.02.
geartrade.com/item/314016/b…

The Osprey Kode series sounds like it fits the bill, at least most if not all your criteria. Just a suggestion so you have even more choices to review.

I have the Kode 30 and LOVE it! An all around badass winter "snow play" pack.

Mammut Trion Guide - it's bigger than your request, but its so light that you won't care. It's got legitimate suspension and the functions you're looking for.

+1 Matt Bosquez!

Best Alpine Climbing Pack
The robust Mammut Trion Guide 45 + 7 pack offers a variety of packing options and outstanding wearing comfort. It covers the needs of the 4-season climber on single- or multiday tours.
•Adjustable MOTION butterfly™ suspension system helps provide full freedom of movement to your upper body
•2-layer, high-density EVA back padding, hipbelt and shoulder straps are covered with laminated stretch fabric
•Hydration-compatible design features reservoir pocket and drink tube exit port for on-the-go hydration (reservoir sold separately)
•Top lid with internal and external pocket is height-adjustable for extra capacity
•Front pocket with reinforced, abrasion-resistant back is ideal for crampons
•Reinforced ski carrier, 2 stable ice axe carriers; daisy chain gear carrier and detachable rope fixing strap allow you to lash bulky gear onto the pack
•Compression straps can be tensioned at the side or the front
•The Mammut Trion Guide 45 + 7 pack comes with a detachable hipbelt and a spare hipbelt for climbing

Climbs well with swivel suspension at the waist belt.
Crampon pouch is large enough for 2 sets of 'poons plus extras.
Glove friendly zipper pulls.
Top to bottom side access zipper to main compartment (oooh Baby!).
Rope strap under lid and comes with an extra Ski Tether.
Smart and simple tool carrier for modern or classic tools.
LIFETIME GUARANTEE
Carries heavy loads well for the size of the shoulder straps

I bought the blue one for 2 reasons:
1. For a splash of color in a white wintry world.
2. Blue packs absorb less heat from the sun than black ones.
-This will help keep your Nitroglycerin from 'slpoding during any Hollywood portrayal of a climbing rescue!

Deuter Guide 45. Best pack I ever owned.

Thanks for all of the input.

John and Harpo: is the cilo 30:30 with a foam back or rigid frame? The fact that the 30 has only foam padding is exactly the sort of thing that I was hoping to learn on here since that is what I would like to avoid.

Matt and Tom-o: Thanks for directing me towards Mammut. I have had almost no experience with their packs but just looking at features, they look pretty ideal. It sounds like you both have the 45L Guide? Do you (or anyone else on MP) have any experience or advice comparing the other models they have? Trion Series: Element 30, Nordwand 35, Pro 35, Alpinist 28 or 40,Lite 28 or 40, Guide 35+7, Taranaki Model. How are the frames/hip belts/suspension for any of these models if I overfilled them with heavy, pointy bits of metal?

So what sort of experiences have anyone on here had with Mammut bags, good or bad? issues with them fitting funny? durability? Mammut has such a reputation that I assume they are selling bomber quality but any personal experiences to add?

Also, any personal experiences with the MH via rapida 35?

I have the old Mammut Ice 45L. It's a very very well made pack. Carry well. I would buy another Mammut pack if this one wears out.

+1 for the Mammut Trion Guide. Finally found a women specific which is shorter in the torso length. Go big or go small in it ... Adjustable with lots of features.

Most packs in the 30-40 liter range aren't made to carry the weight you listed. They are usually comfortable up to 25lbs and then the frame sheet and wire/rods collapse putting all the weight on your sholders.

Another vote for Deuter Guide...I have the Guide 45L+ as my quiver of one that you speak of. It fits the bill from cragging, overnighters (saddlebag accessory works great to add an extra 10L and you can use to put your food out of reach of critters), multipitch easy climbs, ice climbing, etc. I have a Cilogear 20L worksac that compresses and I throw in the bottom if I think I'll need it to climb.

I don't back country ski, but I know plenty of people that do and use the pack just for that. I've carried a rack, rope, tent, 4L of water, sleeping bag / pad, dinner and a cookpot in mine before. Didn't weigh the pack but if it was less than 45 lbs I'd be surprised. It was very comfortable and wearing it while climbing is surprisingly comfortable despite its stiff back and stiff hipbelt.

From the packs you listed, I have experience with the BD Speed (40L version, the older yellow version). It's been my quiver-of-one pack for over four years, and it still refuses to die. It is most of you mentioned - lightweight, narrow profile, minimalistic, ice tool straps, rope strap, removable lid, removable frame and highly compressable. I used it for cragging, ice climbing, backpacking, multi-day alpine climbing and even on Rainier (I could strap snow pickets and my big boots to the sides). At first, I thought the fabric was too flimsy, but after four years of abuse, it's still going strong (with minor repairs to patch nick here and there). It takes a little getting used to the suspension system - like many mentioned, small packs are not designed to carry heavy loads - if you're used to heavy duty padded backpacking packs, it would feel a bit uncomfortable at first. If you decide on going the BD Speed route, get the 40L version - a friend had a 30L and it was just a slightly bigger daypack, he used it for sidecountry skiing. I also like that my BD pack has crampon patches and straps outside - so I don't have to unload everything to put my crampons on on approaches (you can also use it to tie other things on summer trips, say a tarp or tent poles).

I had the Mammut Trion Guide 35 + 7L for a few months with hopes to easily carry all I needed for a day at the crag with a full trad rack. Although, I could fit everything in the pack, barely. It was a pain to get my rack in and out. The mouth and the side-zip were just a little to small to allow stuffing the full rack in and out. I broke the rack into 3 pieces which could be stuffed but could still feel the cams poking me in the back sometimes. It wasn't too bad fully loaded but I wouldn't want to walk for hours with it like that. I also climbed some multi-pitch with it on but grew to hate that. Too big in my opinion for that but doable if necessary.

I realized I needed a bigger pack for comfort and packability. Bought a 65L Arc Teryx Altra with full-zip and have been much happier. I think it would be hard to find a bag that does what you're asking well. The Mammut is a well-made pack with nice features that seemed very durable though.

Mike: Thanks, it sounds like you have used your bag for most of the same range of uses that I am looking at: Now would you just like to review and compare BD and mammut? Do you know if there are any design/feature changes between the 35 and 45 deuter guides (other than the bottom compartment zip)?

Ross: what more can you tell me about the cushioning/frame of the mammut 35 guide? what does it have for a frame sheet that still allowed you to feel gear through it? When you say it was too big to climb with, do you feel that it was an issue of not enough compression options or limited flexibility or do you think that you are unhappy climbing with any 35L+ pack on?

Does anyone know if there are design/feature changes between the 35 and 45 Mammut Guides?

Well I looked a the BD Speed 40 and it didn't fit me well (6'3" though so a lot of packs don't fit great), otherwise it certainly fit the bill. No opinion on mammut packs as I've never tried them.

Different zip codes on storage needs btw the Deuter Guide 35 and 45 otherwise same concept. If you solely were cragging or long single day alpine climbs I'd own the 35L. I know two guides who do overnight alpine trips using the 35L, so it can be done. I've never used the bottom zipper before (it's a waste of weight in my opinion especially since you have the side zip) and we're not talking about a 75-100L expedition pack.

I couldn't agree more with your opinion of the bottom zip- I've never used it even on my 70+5 osprey- just more weight and a potential week point, at least for me.

What is your opinion of the compression abilities of the deuter 45 when you want climb with it? The extra 10+2L will be great sometimes but I want the bag to disappear into nothing but a waterbottle holder when I'm hanging off of something vertical. If their site is accurate, the external dimensions are really similar for a 25% increase in carrying volume, so it would really come down to compressability for me to not take the 45 over the 35 if I decided on deuter.

From what I remember the frame was two aluminum rods. The straps and back padding were an EVA foam type that was totally fine until I started jamming 20 cams or so in there. I could often feel a cam or two poking my lower back after a short hike. Together with food, 2-3L of water, and everything else I crammed in there it just felt like too much weight in the pack to me.

It packed down for the multi-pitch stuff but was still big enough to get in the way. I could easily lift my arms above my head. Somewhat of a stiff backing though seemed to restrict other movement. My preference is to carry a much smaller bag if absolutely necessary now and of course swap with whoever is following on multi-pitch.