Ethics of Manufacturing a Route

Skat B wrote: Btw..WTF is a crack machine?? I need schematics!! Thanks!

This might help your cause.
Crack machine

Skat B wrote:It would resemble Cobra Crack

BWWAAAAAAHHH!!
It most certainly would not. It would look like a manufactured rail up a blank overhang, complete with chalk and hordes or shirtless bros flailing on TR. At best, it will resemble the gash you'll put through your skull within 5 minutes of attempting to rap down with a giant saw...

Well, shortly after I sawed Manufractured in an "unclimbable" face we managed to climb the wall just beside the crack. Guess it wasn't impossible after all.

Otherwise be prepared for bizarre rappel manipulations and a lot of hard work.

Skat B wrote:Forget the dogs, I'll haul it up there myself. No, I'm not a troll. Yes, this is a legitimate question!! I look down on manufactured routes usually but given the location and the face it would look A LOT better with a steep finger crack!! Yes, I have heard both sides argue over cutting a crack in a quarry (5.11- I think?) Why a finger crack? Finger cracks are badass. I'd make it deep enough to place gear and full-on finger locks. It would resemble Cobra Crack and would be out of my league but just having it there would be pretty cool! Horizontal cracks would be sick but would the route even be climbable ?? Oh, and due to limited funds it won't be a freakin' hand crack and I'm not cutting a nice line just to take a crowbar to it... Btw..WTF is a crack machine?? I need schematics!! Thanks!

Hope Muir rises from his grave and beats the stupid out of you.

It's been done. Someone cut a lazer finger crack into a quarry wall in PA. Anyone else know about this? I have never seen it, but I know or exists.

Kennoyce, I like the way you think, bro!!

@rest of ya, yeah ok it won't be like cobra crack..but it'll be a classic of it's own. It all depends how well I can operate a concrete saw while rapping down.

Clarify again what a "crack machine that I can put in my back yard" looks like.

There's probably some geologic reason why the rock formed that way. I'm not saying that throwing a manmade crack in there is going to have some huge effect on anything, but I really don't think it's OK to modify naturally occurring formations. Especially since there are other cracks out there, and there are perfect splitter finger cracks in gyms.

Someone mentioned that there's a nice crack up in a quarry. That actually sounds pretty sweet. Humans have already done the damage, and you could, with some work, make an outdoor playground of sweet cracks.

One of the reasons I enjoy the outdoors is to get away from humans and human impact. I understand routes aren't much different than hiking trails, as they both serve as a way to get from a to b in the backcountry, but you'd basically be forcing thousands of years of unnatural erosion.

If the rock is unclimbable, admire it for that reason, and why it is that way.

Davis Stevenson wrote: One of the reasons I enjoy the outdoors is to get away from humans and human impact.

Sounds like you should mountaineer. Just you and another dude, hugging in the wilderness.

robrobrobrob wrote:http://www.rockclimbing.com/routes/North_America/United_States/Pennsylvania/Southcentral_Region/Bellefonte_Quarry/Upper_Quarry/manufractured_21811.html Granite would take longer, and I'm thinking the ethics might be different when it's not in a quarry. On the plus side, it wouldn't get polished as quickly. Who owns the land... maybe ask them.

Ethics aside... Having climbed Manufractured I can tell you from experience that this is simply stupid. Manufractured in no way climbed like a normal crack. I think the end result had to be drilled as well (not to mention bolted) to make the holds more comfortable simply so it could be climbed and even then if you didn't use about four layers of tape you'd loose all your skin before the first knuckle on your index middle and ring fingers due to the 90 degree angle between the "crack" and face and the uneven nature of the sawing. I'm sure Rick can elaborate. If I remember correctly the face on both sides of Manufractured ended up with stout routes on them.

Man - how did I get sucked into this obvious trolling?

michaeltarne wrote:I'm confused on the whole overhung slab thing.

Wait a minute, he said:

Skat B wrote: Pre-euthanized dogs from an animal shelter to haul up the saw and the generator.

And you are confused about the slab thing?
Well, I'm not sure I can help.

J Q wrote: Sounds like you should mountaineer. Just you and another dude, hugging in the wilderness.

Yeah, man, except that's what the girlfriend is for.

Anyways, not everything in the world is meant to be climbed... Climb the natural things that can be.

Also as someone above mentioned, it doesn't even sound like much fun.

Skat B wrote:not even the satellites employed by Google Earth can see it.

Oh I missed this before. It can't be wrong if Google doesn't see it!

Concrete saw? Pffft! Amateurs.

Dynamite is where it's at. You might just create the "hardest crack climb in the US", School of Mines did:

Maybe if you just jackhammer the top you can 'naturally' split the rock..

J Q wrote: Sounds like you should mountaineer. Just you and another dude, hugging in the wilderness.

Baaaaaahahahahahahaaha….waaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahaha……….bahahahahahahahah!

Skat B wrote: The catch is that it is located on BLM land....

Thats not a catch! Thats a bonus!
You can ANYTHING you want on BLM land!

josh

Skat B wrote:Clarify again what a "crack machine that I can put in my back yard" looks like.

They're easy to make, all you need is "a toilet paper roll, a cork screw, and some tin foil." or "an avocado, an ice pick, and a snorkel."

Davis Stevenson wrote: ... Climb the natural things that can be..

Bwhaaaa!

Davis Stevenson wrote: that's what the girlfriend is for. .

Exactly but,

Davis Stevenson wrote: it doesn't even sound like much fun.

I disagree

J. Thompson wrote: Thats not a catch! Thats a bonus! You can ANYTHING you want on BLM land! josh

Whoa! Is this really true? Anything on BLM land is fair game?

Davis Stevenson wrote:There's probably some geologic reason why the rock formed that way. I'm not saying that throwing a manmade crack in there is going to have some huge effect on anything, but I really don't think it's OK to modify naturally occurring formations. Especially since there are other cracks out there, and there are perfect splitter finger cracks in gyms

This is true. Creating my own crack may be more work than it's worth. I didn't take into consideration the process of buffing off the sharp edges so I don't tear my fingers up. And, just so I'm clear, 99.9999% of the time I do not like the idea of a manufactured route, especially in an area where there are already existing holds.

Patrick Mulligan wrote:I think the end result had to be drilled as well (not to mention bolted) to make the holds more comfortable simply so it could be climbed and even then if you didn't use about four layers of tape you'd loose all your skin before the first knuckle on your index middle and ring fingers due to the 90 degree angle between the "crack" and face and the uneven nature of the sawing.

Great info. Actually if I'm going through all this work to inevitably create a sport route then, to me, it's a total waste completely!!

Ok, thanks for all the feedback!! This is what happens when I think out loud. Freeing an aid route would probably be more satisfying than creating a new crack anyways. The overall idea was to find a crag where a lot of cracks hadn't seen a FA.

Rick Mix wrote:Well, shortly after I sawed Manufractured in an "unclimbable" face we managed to climb the wall just beside the crack. Guess it wasn't impossible after all. Otherwise be prepared for bizarre rappel manipulations and a lot of hard work.

Thanks, Rick, sorry I missed your post! That's awesome that you were able to create your own line - I think I read about it in "Climbing Magazine" a few years ago maybe? If you say it's a lot of hard work then I'll take your word on that!!