Rumney's Outback Cave?
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This post was originally a comment in *Rumney
Is the Outback Cave known by a different name or is it still out in the woods? |
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It is way, way, way out there. I think Bradley hasn't even found it yet,lol. |
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oh Man, you are killing me. Just a lat and a long for that special crag would be a blessing. |
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Mark - do i get one guess ? |
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Nope. |
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Mark how would you feel about PMing me direction to the Outback Cave? |
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More to my point: |
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That's funny, Mark because, I was thinking 12 to 15 routes with fixed draws as the max. But I think 100 draws total is more realistic since for most climbs, we should only need to fix some of the draws but not all of them. I saw quite a bit of this practice down at The Red my last visit there. |
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amen mark. so many beautiful cliffs, with so many more up and coming. It's nice to keep some off the radar. But, you can't be bolting the next rumney, cause we are! Had a great day out at new said crag on sunday. It could use your eye, but i have been sworn to secrecy. :-) |
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I didn't even notice that you extracted my comment into a thread - thanks Mark! It should have been here in the first place. |
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How quickly do the draws degrade? Most of them are used on overhanging sections, so they probably weather/wear slowly (?). Would this fall under the general crag fund (same people who manage the bolting)? I'd be willing to donate some quick draws too, fwiw. |
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Between weathered draws and worn biners, the biners are the most dangerous part. If a draw simply snapped, you may not deck, but if a worn biner cuts your rope, you will. |
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Again, I agree with Mark, and while every good condition biner donated is appreciated, we should all think about replacing aluminium biners with steel ones when it comes to fixed draws. If you have to use Al, then put a good one on, preferrably one which is not made from "T" cross-sectionally shaped Al stock. Al biners made from round stock are very hard to find these days unless one resorts to using (gasp) oval biners ..... |
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Of course, if we as climbers only used fixed draws where absolutely needed, and otherwise used and removed our own, the danger of old gear would be greatly lessened. |
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Agreed, Mark. |
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M Sprague wrote:If we as a community could step back and get a little under control, it would be better for all of us. We would have more, better looking crags, better relations with the land managers and safer climbing.Tried that recently in an unrelated area. Not all climbers are receptive. If the access fund has a presence in your area, perhaps they could assist (since those issues could end up impacting access to area(s) and safety of climbers). |
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How would you define which routes (or individual bolts) should have fixed draws? |
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IMO I would think if there was a safety issue, like Orangahang where falling on a TR risks shearing your rope, or if its very difficult to clean, those are legitimate reasons for fixed draws, also if a bolt had to go in a spot that is unusually difficult to clip without a preplaced draw. In rare instances, if a few fixed draws helps eliminate a clusterfuck and keeps people moving along, they are worth it. |
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Is the Outback Cave on the north side of the Rattlesnake hiking trail? I have noticed a little bit of rock peaking out from the hillside when approaching from Sandy Hill Road. Is the Outback Cave more difficult to find than the Infinity Wall, hah! |
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M Sprague wrote:IMO I would think if there was a safety issue, like Orangahang where falling on a TR risks shearing your rope, or if its very difficult to clean, those are legitimate reasons for fixed draws, also if a bolt had to go in a spot that is unusually difficult to clip without a preplaced draw. In rare instances, if a few fixed draws helps eliminate a clusterfuck and keeps people moving along, they are worth it. In balance against the negatives, I don't think pure speed and convenience or having to know a few techniques for cleaning your draws are legit. The safety issues, ghettoizing the crag and upsetting land managers and other users and the effort, organization and cost needed to keep them up is not worth it.This is pretty much exactly what I've come to believe, Mark. Thanks for stating it well. |