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Is this space too small for a woodie?

Original Post
ChuiSan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 45

I have finally talked hubby into building a woodie at our home but the space we have is only about 10.5'x 11' with a 6'3" ceiling. am I wasting our time and money?

If we do it, I would probably put a 10x8 at 45deg (with a 6" kicker) on one of the 10.5 wall which will come out about 6' on the ceiling and then a 8x6.5 30deg on the opposite wall, I will have about a foot on the ceiling between the 2 walls which I will put a couple of roof jugs on so I can go up one wall and down the other. I will probably get the HIT system for the 45 wall but I am not sure how many I can fit on it with the low ceiling.

you comments are much appreciated.

Danger-Russ Gordon · · Salt Lake City, UT · Joined Nov 2011 · Points: 590

I'm no expert, so I don't take my own opinion too seriously, but if I were you I would go for it.

Ken Noyce · · Layton, UT · Joined Aug 2010 · Points: 2,648
ChuiSan wrote:Is this space too small for a woodie?
That all depends on the size of your woodie;)
Lanky · · Tired · Joined Jun 2008 · Points: 255

Sounds like a reasonable plan. Be sure to consider the possibility of swinging back and hitting the wall behind you if your feet cut while climbing the 45.

Free advice: skip the hit strips. They're too juggy for real training, IMO. I think you'd be better off buying some matched sets of holds or other system holds instead.

Bobby Hanson · · Spokane, WA · Joined Oct 2001 · Points: 1,230

ChuiSan, take some big bedsheets and mock it up. Tape the sheets to the walls and ceiling where you anticipate the woody will be. This will give you an excellent idea of whether or not the space is too small.

If it feels too small, just make a less steep wall and incorporate smaller holds.

ChuiSan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 45
kennoyce wrote: That all depends on the size of your woodie;)
The bigger the better obviously :D
ChuiSan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 45

Lanky & kBobby - Thanks for the advice about hitting the wall and setting up bedsheets.

Re making it less steep, that would mean less climbing area and less upward movements with the low ceiling :(

Jon Zucco · · Denver, CO · Joined Aug 2008 · Points: 245
ChuiSan wrote: The bigger the better obviously :D
it's not the size of the woodie. it's the quality of the route.
Old Timer · · North Andover MA · Joined May 2010 · Points: 27,785

No, it's not too short! My home wall is in a basement with a 7 foot ceiling and when you put the wall angle at 45 degrees I can consistently set boulder problems with 5-10 moves. Make some plywood volumes and just get some decent 1/4 pad and 1/2 pad handhold sets and realize that the wall is to develop power and finger strength, not endurance. Good Luck

ChuiSan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 45

Thanks Old Timer, that's reassuring even though your ceiling is a whole 9" higher than mine :D (my friends didn't think I could do more than a couple of moves on an eight foot long wall). What size kicker do you have?

I think I will go for it, off to search for t-nuts ...

Andy Librande · · Denver, CO · Joined Nov 2005 · Points: 1,880
ChuiSan wrote: off to search for t-nuts ...
Here is a link to all of the places that I could find that sell T-nuts, the prices should be pretty close: andylibrande.com/homeclimbi…

Your wall will be small but doable. However the overall expense will be pretty low in materials so it could be a cheap training tool. Just don't buy a bunch of holds at first until you are sure you like it as holds are by far the most expensive thing on a wall.
ChuiSan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 45

Thanks Andy. That t-nut list was very helpful, I think cheapholds has the best price now for 1000 with the 15% off and free shipping. Do you think putting around 200 per 4x8 is a bit overkill?

Kevin Stricker · · Evergreen, CO · Joined Oct 2002 · Points: 1,197

200 sounds about right. My favorite pattern is a 4" x 8" grid offset every row by 4" beginning 2" from the edges. (row 1:2",10",18",26",34",42" . Row 2:6",14",22",30",38",46").You end up with a 6" spacing diagonally between T nuts and can still use 16" OC framing. If you go with a 6" t-nut spacing you always have at least 2 rows that conflict with the framing no matter the offset, and 4" spacing is a bit overkill.

As for drilling, stack all the sheets and screw/clamp them together at least 4 at once. Buy a cheap drill press attachment for your corded drill and a decent brad point drill. Set the limit stop on the drill press to drill about 1/2 way through your bottom sheet. Now you only have to do your layout once, and you can use your bottom sheet as a template for the rest of your sheets. You also only have to worry about drilling one unbacked sheet(use scrap 2x4 to drill into).

ChuiSan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 45
Kevin Stricker wrote:200 sounds about right. My favorite pattern is a 4" x 8" grid offset every row by 4" beginning 2" from the edges. (row 1:2",10",18",26",34",42" . Row 2:6",14",22",30",38",46").You end up with a 6" spacing diagonally between T nuts and can still use 16" OC framing. If you go with a 6" t-nut spacing you always have at least 2 rows that conflict with the framing no matter the offset, and 4" spacing is a bit overkill. As for drilling, stack all the sheets and screw/clamp them together at least 4 at once. Buy a cheap drill press attachment for your corded drill and a decent brad point drill. Set the limit stop on the drill press to drill about 1/2 way through your bottom sheet. Now you only have to do your layout once, and you can use your bottom sheet as a template for the rest of your sheets. You also only have to worry about drilling one unbacked sheet(use scrap 2x4 to drill into).
Thanks for the great advice about drilling. Just want to get this right, do you separate the rows by 4"? Horizontally, they are spaced by 8", so 4" between rows, I will get 192 t-nuts per panel.

Would there be any conflict with the framing if I do 4" horizontally and vertically offset? Since I am getting 1000 t-nuts and will only have room for 4.5 panels, I may do 1 panel with more t-nuts...

Thanks!
MTN MIA · · Vail · Joined May 2006 · Points: 405

Small space = small woodie

Kevin Stricker · · Evergreen, CO · Joined Oct 2002 · Points: 1,197

Yes, 4" horizontally between rows( typically lay plywood panels horizontally) with 8" between t-nuts vertically.

I have built a couple walls with 4" spacing both ways, if you have the t-nuts then go for it. It is a lot more drilling though.

Realize that the top of your top panel does not need the last row of t-nuts drilled to 2" from the edge as you usually want jugs at the top. If you are building two sides that join with a small roof panel you may want to frame and sheath both of your big walls then add sleepers(horizontal 2x4's layed flat) to mount your roof panel to. This will let you only have to do any tapered cuts on the roof panel to meet up with the main walls. If you make these cuts with a 45degree bevel you get a nice tight joint.

Depending on the orientation of your rafters/joists realize you may need to have both of the top plates sitting on sleepers already. If you haven't yet I would recommend looking at the How To guide on the Metolius website for building walls. It is the best guideline I have found. Over engineering a wall really does not add much to the cost, I would frame your 45 wall with 2x8's, and hang the stringers(joists) from joist hangers.

ChuiSan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 45
Kevin Stricker wrote:Yes, 4" horizontally between rows( typically lay plywood panels horizontally) with 8" between t-nuts vertically. I have built a couple walls with 4" spacing both ways, if you have the t-nuts then go for it. It is a lot more drilling though. Realize that the top of your top panel does not need the last row of t-nuts drilled to 2" from the edge as you usually want jugs at the top. If you are building two sides that join with a small roof panel you may want to frame and sheath both of your big walls then add sleepers(horizontal 2x4's layed flat) to mount your roof panel to. This will let you only have to do any tapered cuts on the roof panel to meet up with the main walls. If you make these cuts with a 45degree bevel you get a nice tight joint. Depending on the orientation of your rafters/joists realize you may need to have both of the top plates sitting on sleepers already. If you haven't yet I would recommend looking at the How To guide on the Metolius website for building walls. It is the best guideline I have found. Over engineering a wall really does not add much to the cost, I would frame your 45 wall with 2x8's, and hang the stringers(joists) from joist hangers.
Thanks Kevin,

You are right, it will be a lot of extra drilling for just 1 panel, I may just put them in randomly after doing the grid you suggested.

is texture paint worth the effort & money? How much does it help with hold spinning?
Andy Librande · · Denver, CO · Joined Nov 2005 · Points: 1,880
ChuiSan wrote: is texture paint worth the effort & money? How much does it help with hold spinning?
Not on a steep indoor wall. Most holds will not spin to begin with. For my bigger holds adding a screw to them on the edge stops all spinning. Most new holds come with a pilot-hole if they are sizable.

Also having extra t-nuts allows for you to build volumes, which are an awesome addition to your wall and are cheap/easy to build.
Adam F. · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Oct 2006 · Points: 5

I have used a hammer drill to make my own holds from real rock. 3/16 hole for countersunk deck screws. Then you can put the holds wherever you want and are not limited by the T nuts.

I would even be willing to sell a few if you want to check them out.
Here are a few I have made:

Rock Holds

Woodchuck ATC · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2007 · Points: 3,280
Adam F. wrote:I have used a hammer drill to make my own holds from real rock. 3/16 hole for countersunk deck screws. Then you can put the holds wherever you want and are not limited by the T nuts. I would even be willing to sell a few if you want to check them out. Here are a few I have made:
Are those sandstone or something much harder? So many drilled sandstone holds just break throuth the holes with a forceful foot hold or dyno.
ChuiSan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Nov 2012 · Points: 45
Andy Librande wrote: Not on a steep indoor wall. Most holds will not spin to begin with. For my bigger holds adding a screw to them on the edge stops all spinning. Most new holds come with a pilot-hole if they are sizable. Also having extra t-nuts allows for you to build volumes, which are an awesome addition to your wall and are cheap/easy to build.
Great idea to add volumes, I will save the extra t-nuts for that!
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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