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Cabiner Craze?

Original Post
NYClimber · · New York · Joined Jul 2011 · Points: 85

It's been about 20 yrs since I climbed since getting back into the sport again in 2011 and I am dazed at the.number of carabiner manufacturer's and designs out these days! Do we really NEED like 10 carabiner manufacturer's - and do we REALLY NEED ovals, bent gates, straight gates, wire gates, dovals, junior 'biners, magnetic lockers? In mean....just how many 'biner designs do we really NEED? Hell - Robbins and Chouinard didn't need so many configurations - so why do we?
Hasn't this marketing and hype gone just a tad too far?

BurtMachlan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2012 · Points: 0

No of course we dont "need" any of them. But if you cant understand why you would use a product that works better over another one than you are pretty dumb. I guess we dont "need" modern harnesses either, swami belts work but they sure are uncomfortable. How old and crusty are you exactly? And you are complaining about the number of manufactures? That is just a free market economy, try not to be such an idiot... Do you not participate in any other sports? There are about 100 special types of mountain bikes, snow skis, kayaks etc... Welcome to 2012.

If you dont need any of those fancy new carabiners than I suggest you stop bitching and go buy a rack of ovals. No one wants to hear it, go back and live in your glory days of oval biners...

FrankPS · · Atascadero, CA · Joined Nov 2009 · Points: 276
BurtMachlan wrote:No of course we dont "need" any of them. But if you cant understand why you would use a product that works better over another one than you are pretty dumb. I guess we dont "need" modern harnesses either, swami belts work but they sure are uncomfortable. How old and crusty are you exactly? And you are complaining about the number of manufactures? That is just a free market economy, try not to be such an idiot... Do you not participate in any other sports? There are about 100 special types of mountain bikes, snow skis, kayaks etc... Welcome to 2012. If you dont need any of those fancy new carabiners than I suggest you stop bitching and go buy a rack of ovals. No one wants to hear it, go back and live in your glory days of oval biners...
Hey, Burt - another classy, "You're dumb" and "don't be an idiot" post from you. What a shocker. Your name-calling is your trademark.
Colonel Mustard · · Sacramento, CA · Joined Sep 2005 · Points: 1,241
s.price wrote:I think BM needs an enema. Something has GOT to be stuck up there.
Heh. I didn't know he had a history going on. Considering the OP though, you have to admit he wasn't too off base with the response. I was thinking dickhead, sure, but an apropos dickhead in this instance.
BurtMachlan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2012 · Points: 0
s.price wrote: This guy BM never has a good word to say. He acts as though he was never a noob. It's a legit question from anyone. Give the guy some shit for his spelling but then let it go. Enough of the playground style smackdown.
Cry me a river. The guy asked for it, he isnt a noob. Apparently he thinks he was quite the badass back in the day of hemp ropes and oval biners.

Its really not a legit question. Even if you are a total rock climbing NOOB it is pretty easy to figure out why there are 10 companies with a variety of designs out there. Like i said its just like ANY other sport or hobby, there are tons of variations on products and last time I checked this was America where as many companies can produce as many products as they want.

The guy asks a stupid question he gets a stupid response... Yeah reprimanding him for missing two letters in a word is a WAY better response.
BurtMachlan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2012 · Points: 0
FrankPS wrote: Hey, Burt - another classy, "You're dumb" and "don't be an idiot" post from you. What a shocker. Your name-calling is your trademark.
Hey frank, nice post moron. Did you come on here to just call me out? You could have at least taken the time to answered the OP's question like I did...even if I did call him an idiot. At least now he maybe is a little bit less of a moron and can figure out why there are multiple variations of caribiners out there.

SP - You couldnt answer the guys question either? Or did you just think it was to obvious to warrant a response...

Hey I got a question. WHY are there like 20 different car makers out there? And WHY do they all make different models? Isnt one car manufacturer and one model enough, do we REALLY need pickups, sedans, sports cars etc. Isnt one type of car ENOUGH?
Josh Wood · · NYC · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 120

Yes, most of the extra brands of carabiners are unnecessary. Is there any difference between one HMS carabiner and another? Not really. Every company makes one hoping that theirs will be better, but they're almost all the same. Same size, 25kN on major axis, etc. But there is a difference between ovals, D shaped, pear shaped, and all the other types. Each is best for a specific situation. I personally prefer wiregate quickdraws to draws with a solid gate, but others don't. I also prefer screwlocks over autolockers, another thing that makes a slight difference. Sometimes the difference is slight, but why not have it. Occasionally a biner comes along that is the only one in its class, such as the Black Diamond Magnetron or the Petzl Ange quickdraws. I won't be surprised if other companies start copying these new designs.

Anonymous · · Unknown Hometown · Joined unknown · Points: 0

Hey Burt bro, try one post without a rude comment.

As the Beatles say "Love the people, love the people."

BurtMachlan · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2012 · Points: 0
This post violated Rule #1. It has been removed by Mountain Project.
Carl Sherven · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Dec 2007 · Points: 210
BurtMachlan wrote: Hey SP which I can only imagine stands for short penis, whats your problem? Why you gotta pic on everyone and judge? You have no idea...
Ah, I wondered what your issue was.

South Park Episode 1504 - T.M.I.
Joe Huggins · · Grand Junction · Joined Oct 2001 · Points: 105
BurtMachlan wrote: Hey SP which I can only imagine stands for short penis, whats your problem? Why you gotta pic on everyone and judge? You have no idea...
So... Burt;you're another one of these guys who can't be bothered to provide any information about yourself on your profile page; you joined a month ago; we're just supposed to accept your Bullshit because you can type? STFU. Try establishing some credibility before you start criticizing; we may even respect your sorry ass, then.
Gryla · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2012 · Points: 0
Joe Huggins wrote: So... Burt;you're another one of these guys who can't be bothered to provide any information about yourself on your profile page; you joined a month ago; we're just supposed to accept your Bullshit because you can type? STFU. Try establishing some credibility before you start criticizing; we may even respect your sorry ass, then.
and so hath spoken the almighty we! HA! accept whatever you like huggy bear, but whether you have been proclaiming your prowess online for an hour or a decade (good use of time, by the way) you do not speak for the 'community.' There is not one. just a bunch of under-grown children who like playing in dirt. So sling some mud, Mr. Fancy.
BackCountry Sortor · · Ogden, UT · Joined Oct 2009 · Points: 400

Mike, there are a lot of carabiners to choose from and they've all got their specialized application. As Burt alluded to, but was too much of an ass to word kindly, it's pervasive in much of this society of consumerism. What's most perplexing to me is why so many of us "buy" into it. If you got the time, this documentary sheds a little light on who we've become. I highly recommend watching it!

youtube.com/watch?v=prTarrg…

frankstoneline · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Apr 2009 · Points: 30

To the OP: the variety of manufacturers and styles allows for a nice variety of products to satisfy a range of preferences. It isn't necessary, but it's quite nice.

To the above post regarding burt's contributions, it appears to be a series of irrational complaints about photography skills and one inane attempt at pointing out safety non-issues while feeding slack with a gri gri. One can only begin to imagine the suffering his ex wives must have endured.

Elena Sera Jose · · colorado · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 350

OK explain something: climbing is supposed to put things in perspective for an individual and build character, comoraderie, resilience, wisdom ....all the good stuff. So why are u guys acting like a bunch of teenage cheerleaders? Ur dumb! ...no ur dumb! No u! Ridiculous....

bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065

marketing ... pure and simple ...

any decent biner will work ... some work a bit better than others in different applications such as wiregates where weight matters, or solid gate notchless for overhung sport ... but in general all the fancy $$$$$$ biners are to stroke yr gear ego ...

remember that macleod used neutrinos on the long hope E10, honnold and steck used em on speed runs up the nose, and florine/hirayama used old notched biners on their previous run ...

there is no performance advantage to spending $$$$ on biners ... you can get good quality light biners with the features you want for reasonable prices these days

but companies need to come up with ways to part you with your money ..

NYClimber · · New York · Joined Jul 2011 · Points: 85

Thanks Bearbreeder, FRankstoneline, BCSorter and Joshw97 for your legitimate answers. Yes I realize that some of this is due to marketing and others are because as another member stated - "Why we have 10 different manufactures of cars" these days. Yeah - I get that. And yes - of course it is nice to have a choice and a variety of goods to select from and choose something to your liking.

And yes - I admit - it was a stupid question - with the answer quite obvious - that each manufacture hopes to gain an advantage or 'one-up' on their competition to sell their wares - or perhaps offer an improvement of better version (or idea) of a particular design.

Point taken...

Elena Sera Jose · · colorado · Joined Mar 2012 · Points: 350

mike dont let them make u feel stupid! u r not i tell u . u are a smart person and the douches here are just bored.

paintrain · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2007 · Points: 75
BurtMachlan wrote: Hey SP which I can only imagine stands for short penis, whats your problem? Why you gotta pic on everyone and judge? You have no idea...
http://www.mountainproject.com/u/burtmachlan//107618460?action=contribs&

Its not hard to figure it out BM. You don't say much of anything unless it's douchey.

PT
Simon Thompson · · New Paltz, NY · Joined Apr 2011 · Points: 890

I think some of us need to take another look at "Guideline #1: don't be a jerk."

Who's stupider: the person who writes a dumb post, or the person who wastes their time replying to it?

paintrain · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jan 2007 · Points: 75

To point out a history of abusiveness doesnt make you jerk. It is an attempt to clean up the MP community with little coercion.

You can choose to ignore it and that is valid and sometimes more appropriate. In this case (its in his post record), he is getting called to the carpet for a history of it.

PT

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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