Time to un-bolt Mount Everest?

Chris treggE wrote: Are you saying that Climbing Fascist and Killis are one and the same? Now that would be an amusing discovery.

That would have been some funny one man arguments over the last few months. I can't keep all of the negative troll types straight.

Andrew Gram wrote:Just curious, but how many folks in this thread have been above 20K before? I'm guessing none.

That's exactly what I was thinking. Hiking a 14er in your chacos doesn't make you a mountaineer.

Andrew Gram wrote: I've climbed lots of big peaks so i'm very familiar with shuttling. I don't have more than 30 pounds or so in each load I shuttle though. Your exaggeration was off by an order of magnitude, which leads me to believe you don't really know what you are talking about.

I just talked to my buddy who did Denali last year and he said 50 pounds in the pack, 50 pounds on the sled. Food and fuel for the return trip and of course plenty for bad weather days. But that's not even the point. Point is you started out denegrating and every comment you have made has been more of the same. Congrats on your above 20,000 foot career, the rest of us are just dumb ass bottom dwelling flatlanders.

rging wrote: My mistake, I meant to say its on the second step where a Chinese group put it up in the 70s. I wonder if it's a Chinese made ladder? Only good thing they ever made if it is.

Put up in the 60's (1960 I believe) - but you are getting closer....
Since you are such an expert - name the first 5 successful ascents of Everest - year and nationality - they were all big national teams.

matt davies wrote: I whipped on Kiener's (off) Route- true story.

Do tell!

Rschap wrote: That's exactly what I was thinking. Hiking a 14er in your chacos doesn't make you a mountaineer.

If you do it with a scotch in one hand and a bag of chocolate in the other, then of course you have mountain-style.

Eric Engberg wrote: Put up in the 60's (1960 I believe) - but you are getting closer.... Since you are such an expert - name the first 5 successful ascents of Everest - year and nationality - they were all big national teams.

Is that your final answer? Not. I couldn't remember the exact year so I cheated and looked it up. 1975. Either way, that's one durable piece of aluminum. Just think how bad the person who steps on it and breaks it is going to feel (hopefully on his/her way down).

Without looking I would have to say Sir Ed (and Norgay) of New Zealand early 50s maybe 53, Chinese in mid 50s, United States early 60s, then probably India, or Japan.

It would be a shame to remove the ladders now, they're part of "history".

AntinJ wrote: Do tell!

Since you asked... I got off route at the semi-technical rock step after the Broadway traverse. I was trying to skirt around another party doing the regular route, and thought I spied a cool line to the left that looked harder, but not that hard. Anyway, I made about a half dozen moves I couldn't reverse way run-out in mountaineering boots, got a stopper in just under a mossy sloper of a ledge, stepped on the ledge and whoosh. We were using a single half rope (because we weren't going to fall), and I fell with the piece just below my feet and ended up about 12 feet below the piece with stretch. Not really a whipper, more of a whimper. Kinda exciting, mostly embarrassing.
Anyway, if you find yourself clipping a fused stopper on Keiner's, you're off route.

Still new to the forum but I'll jump on into this fray since I'm fascinated with Everest for some sick reason. This year I followed the expeditions via twitter and instagram and a couple websites which was really neat. As someone who is NOT a mountaineer, and just started following trad last year (ex-gym rat here, who wants to move towards real climbing, trad, alpine, etc.) I can't say my thoughts or opinions hold a ton of weight. However I'm fairly well read and have watched a few too many documentaries.

My thought is this. I can't take anything away from anyone who summits Everest, regardless of how. (Helicopters are not plucking people off the summit, there has only been one unconfirmed Heli on the Summit, but they are however doing rescues higher than ever) A perfectly crafted stairway all the way up the mountain would still prove to be a semi arduous task. Hell, go to a ski town. A whopping 8,000 feet in good ol kushy Breckenridge, and you'll see perfectly fit people huffing and puffing after three flights of stairs. And at that point you're not even scraping the surface of what the foothills of Everest are like. So if you get up there, short of a Sherpa literally carrying you up you did some work.

On the flipside though, as a climber, as an outdoor enthusiast, and as an opinionated jerk I will say I'm not a fan of the methods of climbing Everest; and the connection to the all mighty dollar. I guess to try to wrap this up quicker; season two of the Discovery Channel Everest show with Russel Brice had one person who was proof positive of what is and has been wrong with Everest for the last couple decades. There was a woman, on the expedition, expecting to summit Everest, but had never climbed any mountain anywhere before. She couldn't even put on crampons. I mean, realistically speaking that's like someone who's never so much as played pee-wee football walking into an NFL locker room to suit up as the starting quarterback.

Hiring a guide to climb, fine. I'm all for it, It's a great way to learn, in fact I suggest it. If you're new, get a guide. Get someone to protect you, to teach you, to help you. Don't go doing it on the playground of the elite. Don't go plunking down $60k+ to be dragged to summit of the highest mountain in the world. Go learn on a mountain that you can LEARN on. Is Everest the most technical climb? Not even close, but it still shuts down world class climbers. It is still having records set and broken every single year. It is still a place for the elite to go show what they are made of. But when elite climbers are being held up, injured, killed etc. because of a traffic jam of non-climbing tourists that's a problem. The $$ is a powerful thing. As a guide, if they are willing to show you the money, you're going to be willing to show them the top. However I really think some discretion should be used. Not every jerk with $60k deserves to climb the mountain. It should be reserved for the climbing elite. For the Hillary's, the Messners, and the Ankers of the climbing world.

If you're a new rock climber is your guide going to pull you up a 5.14 multi-pitch? NOPE. So why should they do it in mountaineering? You wanna climb 5.14 you learn, you improve, you work your way up. You wanna climb Everest you should learn, improve, and work your way up.

• end rant*

(sorry so long winded for a new guy lol)