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Mastercam 0 - Broken Cam Stop

Luke to Zuke · · Anchorage · Joined Apr 2008 · Points: 220

Wow, being a fan of master cams this is devistating news. But, just to let it be known. That cam looks alittle more than never been hung/taken a fall.... just sayin...

Count Chockula · · Littleton, CO · Joined Aug 2006 · Points: 5

Trust me when I say that the cam has NEVER taken a fall, and if I've ever hung on it, I was too scared at the time to remember. Just sayin'. ;-)

Toby Butterfield · · Portland, OR · Joined Aug 2010 · Points: 140

Yeah, bummer indeed. Let us know how your efforts to get it replaced by Metolius turn out!

Cor · · Sandbagging since 1989 · Joined Mar 2006 · Points: 1,445

send the cams back. the guys at metolius are super nice!
on another note, this is nothing new. look at old forums...
i sent back a bunch (maybe 6, i can't remember) it is not just
the master cams, it is also the tcu's that have the same problem.
i mentioned to the r&d dept. about changing the design of the cam stops to a triangle shape. (like the larger cams have) seems like a simple fix, but what do i know... (they never did get back to me)
oh, and by the way they told me (if i remember correctly)
1.5 kill-a-cam-stop-newtons on the little square buggers.
which means you can put the cam in a vise in your garage, without engaging the cams, yank on it, and break them. ;)

anyway, happy monday!

cor

Richard Hunter · · Boston, MA · Joined Apr 2009 · Points: 1,962

I had the same issue with the blue MC, though I did fall on it in a weird placement. Metolius was great about replacing it. I've gone back to using TCU's for the little stuff though, as I never had an issue with them.

Count Chockula · · Littleton, CO · Joined Aug 2006 · Points: 5

Sent in the broken cam the end of last week. Imagine my surprise when I checked the mail yesterday and received a shiny, new #0 Mastercam from Metolius! I'm very impressed with the quick turnaround.

It appears they changed the design of the lobes in the last couple years. My broken #0 (stamped w/09) had the little "teeth" in the lobes. The new one I received has smooth lobes, which seems to be the typical design for most cams this small.

Gunkiemike · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2009 · Points: 3,492
Dave Holliday wrote:The same thing just happened to me today. My first piece on the route was the purple mastercam (second smallest size, I think) and as I was being lowered it came rocketing out of its placement. One of the cam stops had sheared off.
And you never put your weight on it? It came out due only to the light force imparted by the rope as it ran - probably at a sharp angle if your belayer was out from the wall - through it as you were being lowered? Yikes.

But then one could argue that anytime the cam stops are loaded, the placement is already worthless/failed.
Count Chockula · · Littleton, CO · Joined Aug 2006 · Points: 5

At least you should have no problem getting it replaced. When I spoke to Metolius they seemed very aware of this issue with the two smaller Mastercams, 00 and 0. Replacement should be quick and easy.

metoliusclimbing.com/warran…

bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065

POOFAY ... cam stops blown and inverted

fell 5 feet above it at the lower crux ... gear looked ok when placed, not to say it didnt shift, id fallen on it at the same placement before ...

gonna return it to MEC

blown purple tcu

Ben Beard · · Superior, AZ · Joined Jun 2009 · Points: 215

This post got me thinking, and this is no way making any accusations against people who posted on here.

On these small cams, no matter which brand, getting 5-10 feet above that tiny cam could generate some high forces in a fall (correct me if I am wrong). Are the cam manufacturers too generous in giving out free replacements for every small cam that breaks? For a 4-5kN cam, something has to give in a serious fall. Are climbers too cheap to just get a new piece when their tiny cams get tweaked?

bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065

depends how high up you are and how straight the rope runs ... the TCU was around 30-40feet off the deck with a straight rope

either way manufacturers live by their reputations .... if they dont cover blown cams at a minimal/no costs people will simply buy other brands that are known for their customer service .. . or buy from rei/mec that covers it

a poignant lesson is the excellent warranty from OR, EB, REI, lands end, etc ... where you can return a product for ANY reason ...

they still make moola ... and indeed some people buy from them because of it ...

Ryan Williams · · London (sort of) · Joined May 2009 · Points: 1,245
Ben Beard wrote:This post got me thinking, and this is no way making any accusations against people who posted on here. On these small cams, no matter which brand, getting 5-10 feet above that tiny cam could generate some high forces in a fall (correct me if I am wrong).
The force is no higher than if you got 5 to 10 feet above a #2 Camalot. The problem is, the small cams are rated to 4-5kN and the bigger ones around 12kN.

Ben Beard wrote:Are the cam manufacturers too generous in giving out free replacements for every small cam that breaks?
No. I did end up contacting Metolius and they offered to sell me a new new one at a discounted price. Their thinking is that the cam is not designed for free climbing, which is what I was doing. Not generous, but not necessarily wrong either.

Ben Beard wrote:Are climbers too cheap to just get a new piece when their tiny cams get tweaked?
Yes.
Alan Ream · · Lafayette CO · Joined Feb 2006 · Points: 5,405

Wow - I was surprised to see this post. I just had the exact same issue with my purple # o Metolius Master cam last week. I called Metolius about it and they basically said it was toast and there was nothing they could do "one for the trophy wall" . This is after consulting two mountain shops for advise about it and they both thought I should call. None of my other cams seem to have this problem as of yet. Some sort of design flaw? Or just bad luck? Anyway, I bought a new one to replace it - Hopefully it will be more robust.

Ryan Williams · · London (sort of) · Joined May 2009 · Points: 1,245
Alan Ream wrote:Wow - I was surprised to see this post. I just had the exact same issue with my purple # o Metolius Master cam last week. I called Metolius about it and they basically said it was toast and there was nothing they could do "one for the trophy wall" . This is after consulting two mountain shops for advise about it and they both thought I should call. None of my other cams seem to have this problem as of yet. Some sort of design flaw? Or just bad luck? Anyway, I bought a new one to replace it - Hopefully it will be more robust.
What on earth makes you think the new one will be "more robust?"
Alan Ream · · Lafayette CO · Joined Feb 2006 · Points: 5,405

They have redesigned the lobes - they are now different (smooth lobes - no ridges and the cam stops seem thicker. etc) So I am hopeful - Perhaps there was just a bad batch or something. My other ones have not had this issue - even the smaller grey one seems fine. Time will tell.

Purple # 0 Metolius cam with broken cam stop - next to a new one.

bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065
Alan Ream wrote:Wow - I was surprised to see this post. I just had the exact same issue with my purple # o Metolius Master cam last week. I called Metolius about it and they basically said it was toast and there was nothing they could do "one for the trophy wall" . This is after consulting two mountain shops for advise about it and they both thought I should call. None of my other cams seem to have this problem as of yet. Some sort of design flaw? Or just bad luck? Anyway, I bought a new one to replace it - Hopefully it will be more robust.
alan ... did metolius do anything for you ... such as sell a unit at a discounted rate or cover it?

thanks
Alan Ream · · Lafayette CO · Joined Feb 2006 · Points: 5,405

Nope - nothing - That would have been great. I would have even paid something to have new lobes put on - I am guessing I just caught someone having a bad day - perhaps one too many conversations about broken cam stops. Oh well - for the most part I really like Metolius and believe in their stuff. I use quite a lot of it.

bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065

hmmmm ... im crossing those purple metolius of my list ... personally id rather buy from companies that do something for the customer

im sure some people here will complain about the statement above ... but then its my money, not yours ;)

good thing i buy all my cams from mec ... saves having to deal with the manufacturer ... i took back a BD 0.3 whose internal springs blew out ... they gave me credit no questions asked

Leeroy · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Feb 2012 · Points: 0
Ben Beard wrote: Are climbers too cheap to just get a new piece when their tiny cams get tweaked?
Yes.

Even when they are using it for protecting free climbs. Despite Metolius only recommending it for body weight placements on aid climbs.

Sure, they "can" catch a fall and are probably better than nothing but it should come as a surprise to absolutely no one, that these small cams can get mangled in a fall.

Maybe it's time to think about investing in a few ball nutz fella's? You get 2 more KN and better range for $20 less!
Ray Pinpillage · · West Egg · Joined Jul 2010 · Points: 180
bearbreeder wrote:POOFAY ... cam stops blown and inverted fell 5 feet above it at the lower crux ... gear looked ok when placed, not to say it didnt shift, id fallen on it at the same placement before ... gonna return it to MEC
You got lucky before, there is a reason Metolius doesn't rate that cam at 12KN. You were using the gear outside of its intended purpose and now you expect someone else to shoulder the responsibility. The cam didn't just break, YOU broke it.

It makes me wonder when you complain about Arcteryx how much you play in that equation. Or rather, if you're misusing that gear too and expecting them to be responsible.
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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