Best trad/alpine/extendable draw

I'm sick and tired of the hodge podge of oval biners and manky sling that make up my rack. Ready to drop some bucks, within reason, on a nice set of extendable draws and biners. Just curious what would give me the best bang for my buck, thinking longevity weight and ease of clipping. Also nylon dyneema pros cons. Im leaning towards the nylon, i"m not a fan of whipping on dental floss. Suggestions please

Trango Ultratape is a good mix for sling material and decently priced. (use spad15 or fw15 for 15% off at moosejaw - looks like MJ is sold out of them right now) I do like nylon's durability and strength after knots/bends.

For size, weight and value, WC Nitro's are probably darn hard to beat.

As I always advocate, buy on sale! I picked up a couple Nitro sport draws 20% off and that made the 'biners around $5.50/ea.

Mammut Dyneema

All my "alpine draws" are 24" x 11/16" sewn nylon slings and Trango Superfly wiregate carabiners.

There are lighter carabiners, but I have had these for a while and they work well for me. As far as nylon vs other stuff, the decision is easy for me. Nylon is more durable and has a smaller loss of strength when knotted. It is also more resistant to cutting and is cheaper. I don't climb hard enough for the few ounces of weight that dynema saves to make a difference.

That being said, one of my climbing partners has a bunch of "dental floss" slings and super light-weight DMM carabiners, and I have never thought twice about using them.

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Grab either Neutrinos, Oz, or Superflys and you're done.

Go with the dental floss. Although it may be unnervingly skinny, it is still way stronger than the manky sling that you are currently using, not to mention that it is lighter and less bulky. With the slings, I feel like the big advantage of the dental floss isn't the weight (actual weight difference between 10 skinny slings and 10 fat nylon slings isn't that much), but rather is the reduced bulk; it just takes up less space on your harness. Also, if you get small wiregates to pair with these slings, the skinnier slings sit better in the small biners when the sling is tripled; a tripled nylon sling is a lot of bulk in a Neutrino or similar.

Although it is nice to have mostly dyneema, it is worth supplementing with a few nylon slings, since there are things you can do with nylon that you can't with dyneema, such as friction hitches (kleimheist, etc). When you have to leave a bail sling, it is also nice to have a few cheap nylon slings that you feel OK about parting with.

For biners, most lightweight wiregates will do. Definately go wiregate over solid gate. How small/light you are willing to go with the wiregates will depend on personal preference and how big your hands are (the truly ham-fisted have a hard time with the smallest biners). Just buy whatever wiregates you can find on sale that feel right in your hand.

If you want to buy the best, go for notchless: WC Helium, DMM Alpha Trad, or Petzl Ange Large. It's expensive, but so worth it. They are all full size biners that weigh about 33 grams. If you want the absolute lightest, get some Camp Nanos at 23 grams. If you still want lightweight but can't stand tiny biners, there are a few slightly bigger options for wiregates in the 25-30 gram range. The DMM alpha light is a notchless wiregate carabiner under 30 grams.

Regarding not whipping on dental floss:

I like the Misty Mountain 9/16" nylon slings for extendable draws. They are noticeably less bulky than 11/16" nylon slings and still "break in excess of 4800 pounds."

worth russell wrote:i"m not a fan of whipping on dental floss.

It's just as strong as nylon, and exactly what you ask for, so just get over it.

I'm a fan of the Blue Water Titan runners, I think they have a nice middle ground between the "Dental Floss" and the nylon.

gabemcg wrote:Regarding not whipping on dental floss: I like the Misty Mountain 9/16" nylon slings for extendable draws. They are noticeably less bulky than 11/16" nylon slings and still "break in excess of 4800 pounds."

Me too.

What about switching over to rabbit runners?

i use nitros, shields and BD dyneema slings for extendibles ... i would recommend the nitros and BDs

as long as its decently light it makes no difference to me ... dyneema slings though are less bulky, easier to tie for me and saves a tad of weight

i save the money from splurging on fancy biners for gas these days ...

milfred wrote: Mammut Dyneema

+1

Throw a couple light wiregate biners on these and you're good to go.

I don't know why anyone still uses the fatter, heavy, water-absorbing nylon. Go with an 8mm dyneema sling, and two carabiners of an ounce (29g) or less at either end.

C.A.M.P. Mach Express

Lightest Carabiner in the world at one end

Lightest full-sized 'biner in the world at the other

8mm dyneema runner, stronger and more abrasion-resistant then nylon, used to connect them.

C.A.M.P. Mach Express-

muttonface wrote: To the OP- if you're splurging for entirely new stuff including biners, I would consider something notchless, at least on one end of your extendable draws. It doesn't make a huge difference when you're extending your draws, but if you're like me, every once in a while, a snag on the notch when you're trying to just extend it and clip quick is a pain in the ass. YMMV.

+1

BD Hoodwire, Dmm Alpha trad, WC Helium, Ange size L, etc. are all good light notchless wire gate carabiners.

Dom wrote: +1 BD Hoodwire, Dmm Alpha trad, WC Helium, Ange size L, etc. are all good light notchless wire gate carabiners.

+2 I know plenty of people deal with notch-gate biners and have zero issues, but as soon as I tried a Petzl Spirit I never went back.

Spirits BTW, are a fantastic biner. Defintitely not light but they feel great in-hand and last forever.

If you want to be totally prepared it's good to have a couple of fat nylon slings. More versatile in terms of making friction hitches (ascending, rap back up) or tying a knot in - like after you cut the sling and thread it through something to rap off.

AlKing wrote: I don't know why anyone still uses the fatter, heavy, water-absorbing nylon. Go with an 8mm dyneema sling, and two carabiners of an ounce (29g) or less at either end. C.A.M.P. Mach Express Lightest Carabiner in the world at one end Lightest full-sized 'biner in the world at the other 8mm dyneema runner, stronger and more abrasion-resistant then nylon, used to connect them. C.A.M.P. Mach Express-

Ditto on these, I have homemade versions of them and they weigh nothing.

The majority of my extendable draws are made of BD hoodwires, BD nitrons, and BD dynex slings. I've been happy with them. +1 for notch-less.

Why don't they make rabbit runners in 24", so you can use them for a tripled draw? Seems like that would be a little cleaner than a tripled sling, and it would keep the carabiner oriented, avoiding this whole
retainer mess that can kill you.

Has anyone used these Metolius long draws tripled, or are they too stiff?