anyone think this is dangerous?

so I have a few camalots that needed reslung, and not wanting to send them off, and not have them for a while, I have been using a short dyneema slings doubled up. seems to work fine, and it is possible to extend the sling by hitching it thru the thumb stud. the only thing that I an not sure about is sometimes the hitch will shift, and end up like this:

after the hitch shifts
I have never seen anyone else who is using this set-up, and maybe there is a good reason that I don't know. Does anyone think that this is dangerous?

Yes it may be dangerous keeping this next to the burner on the stovetop.

Any hitch or knot makes the runner weaker...right?

but the runners are rated @ 22kn and the cam # 12-14kn, so I figure the cam will go before the sling. anybody know where I can send it to get tested? I have a #2 that I would sacrifice...

It ain't gonna rip

No way you generate that kind if force

I would spend $4 each and send them to Wired Bliss though

Yep, but not as deangerous as it could be. There's two schools of thought about girth hitches; however, one is technically not a hitch.

If you have a girth hitch where the cord comes back onto itself, that is bad. Extra friction during a fall decreases the holding capacity of the material.

Another thought is if the cord doesn't come back onto itself (think of the girth hitch as more of a square knot) then that's not so bad. You can use this method in a pinch with a nut if youre out of carabiners.

I don't advocate using either of these methods. This was from a lengthy discussion between a couple guys who've been climbing much longer than me. My understanding is that the second part above is contorversial.

Anyway. Why would you use gear in a way its not meant to be used?

I've got to send a few of mine away too. Small price to pay for decreased risk of decking.
I think I saw video of girth hitches failing somewhere...

Instead of girth hitching it like that can you just clip the second end of the sling into the biner. So you clip both ends of the sling, does anyone know if that would be safer? Granted you`d need a longer sling to get the length you want since you`re essentially folding the sling in half

RockinOut wrote:Instead of girth hitching it like that can you just clip the second end of the sling into the biner. So you clip both ends of the sling, does anyone know if that would be safer?

That's essentially a "V hitch", and it is considered a bit safer than girth hitching a sling to a cam- not a bad way to go if you have a trip coming up before you can get your stuff off to be re-slinged.

Not something I would do based on the following from Black Diamond.

blackdiamondequipment.com/e…

Interesting read.

I've done this to my old camalot and my metolius cams. I've fallen on them and they've held fine. However, I recommend as most do paying to get them reslung.

BirdDog wrote:Not something I would do based on the following from Black Diamond. blackdiamondequipment.com/e… Interesting read.

Interesting that BD attributed the lowered strength to the doubled sling. Doubling of the sling would affect the sling's strength but I don't think it would affect the force applied to the thumb loop. It seems to me the damage is caused by the narrower spectra rather than because of the way it was slung.

BirdDog wrote:Not something I would do based on the following from Black Diamond. blackdiamondequipment.com/e… Interesting read.

This only applied to the thumb loop termination. The solid metal stem termination from the previous generation of C4s will not be affected the same way.

why not just water knot some webbing for the time being?

I wouldn't complain about a partner having their cams like that. Your picture might even be better than a normal girth hitch because there looks to be less sharp bending.

Crag Dweller wrote: Interesting that BD attributed the lowered strength to the doubled sling. Doubling of the sling would affect the sling's strength but I don't think it would affect the force applied to the thumb loop. It seems to me the damage is caused by the narrower spectra rather than because of the way it was slung.

The lower strength is due to the increased friction of the sling crossing over itself.

Ray Pinpillage wrote: The lower strength is due to the increased friction of the sling crossing over itself.

but, that's on the sling, right? the damage to the thumb loop wasn't caused because the sling was doubled over. it was caused because the sling was narrower, thus transfering more force/area.

this is all academic because it's not like there are options with wider doubled slings. but, I found it interesting that BD positioned this as though it was the result of the doubled sling. there's as much marketing in that analysis as there is a product safety message.

Jason S. wrote:but hte runners are rated @ 22kn and the cam # 12-14kn, so I figure the cam will go before the sling. anybody know where I can send it to get tested? I have a #2 that I would sacrifice...

You can always send the cam to me for testing.

yup...yer gonna die.

I'd use some nylon webbing and a water knot if you don't have time to send them off to re-sling.

Crag Dweller wrote: but, that's on the sling, right? the damage to the thumb loop wasn't caused because the sling was doubled over. it was caused because the sling was narrower, thus transfering more force/area. this is all academic because it's not like there are options with wider doubled slings. but, I found it interesting that BD positioned this as though it was the result of the doubled sling. there's as much marketing in that analysis as there is a product safety message.

Right, thats only the sling. The kinked thumb loops and split plastic coatings is isolated to the newest C4 design.

Just use the stove to melt the sling knot closed and you'll be good to go....