Real Strong but no endurance WTD???

Like I said I'm real strong for real short time. I don't exactly get pumped for say I just get weak like squeezing tooth paste would be a challenge. I really just go to the gym and just boulder for and hour or two a couple days a week and hang board at my house. My goal is to comfortable lead granite 12's (not sport) Those climbs that have no holds all most featureless. Any one out there got any tips. Alot of the climbing I do is run out so not having endurance is a mind fuck. I guess I forgot to mention that I swim and run on my days off and i dont' want to climb every 5.12 I see .....Just this one. and a six pitch route in the valley that goes at 10c

Try thinking about baseball stats or something.

based on your profile and recent ticks, you've got a long way to go to be comfortable on 12s, even on sport.

an hour or two a couple days week and hang board at house is not nearly enough of climbing to build up either power and endurance.

just climb more, a lot more.

I'm in the same boat. I boulder v5-6 but have trouble on 5.10s if they are over 50 feet. I just sputter out of energy. My goal is to get on more routes and build some endurance.

keep climbing hard but allow your fingers and arms to recover before you go at it again. I would start with a lot of technique and don't be in a rush to get there...enjoy climbing. I cant lead twelves trad or otherwise so take it how you will. I think that not being able to apply toothpaste means your pumped. few people on the earth COMFORTABLY! lead 12s take your time. and you will need to climb more than just boulders 2 times a week to get your endurance up. Some 12s are short!.GET ON THE REAL STUFF!

If you are anything like me, the problem is you are overgripping, or perhaps relying on strength when it is not needed, thus- you burn out.

First off, How is the Cardio? If your not doing much cardio, I would recommend adding 2-3 days of high end aerobic work. The better your cardio is the better your body will be able to deliver O2 to your muscules and also help you recover faster.

You boulder and hangboard that is great for building strength. You should add some endurance training as well. In the gym run laps on climbs. Climb up and down climb, trying to stay on the wall for a specified time, then repeat (interval training). Also check out HIT strip training or systems board, great for strength endurance, but may not translate well to granite climbing.

If you are trying to improve on granite, get on it as much as possible. Alot of granite climbing is technique and finnese while being relaxed especially when placing gear. Which means being really comfortable on the rock, you can't get that in a gym. I see that you climb out at E-Rock, when I lived out there I use to head out to Buzzards Roost, or triple cracks or the backside and set up a tr rope solo and run laps on those climbs. I call it YoYo climbing, climb up, rapel down, repeat without resting, do that til fatigued, take a break and get back on it. I would try to get in 20-30+ pitches of climbing in a day, which is easy when you are rope soloing. I would usually start on steep cracks, climb till my arms were dead, then hit the slabs and work footwork.

Freddy, there are three types of endurance: stamina, aerobic endurance, and anaerobic endurance (power endurance). There are different ways to train each of these areas of climbing. Your body adapts to the stress you put on it. So when you train, you need to mimic the skill you want to gain.

Stamina is your ability to climb multiple routes and keep your strength for a long period of time. Imagine redpointing 10 5.11s in one day. To train stamina you need to climb a lot of routes with good resting periods in between each routes.

Aerobic endurance is your body's ability to remove lactic acid. Imagine climbing a 200 foot 5.11a without getting pumped at all. That is aerobic endurance. To train aerobic endurance you climb routes easy enough that you don't get pumped, but hard enough that you almost get pumped, and you want to be on that route anywhere from 20 to 45 min.

Anaerobic endurance is your body's ability to climb with a pump for a long period of time. Imagine climbing a long 5.12a that you get pumped on for almost the whole route, but you can still climb it because you still have enough strength. To train anaerobic endurance you need to climb something that gets you very pumped. At a bouldering gym do 4x4. Climb 4 routes that get you pumped without any breaks, then rest approx 3 min then do it again. Repeat four times.

All of these endurance skills are important for climbing. If you have good anaerobic endurance, but you don't have good aerobic endurance, you are not going to be able to recover on a jug midway through a 5.12a. You'll just continue to get weaker while "resting."

Last thing I'll say is that increasing strength also increases endurance. You start to get pumped when you cross a certain level of total exertion so when you are stronger the level of exertion required to get pumped increases. With that said, it is still very important to train your endurance!

For more info PM me or buy "The Self Coached Climber." It's the best climbing book on training.

That's my natural state too. I rarely get shut down by cruxes, and almost always fail due to endurance/pump.

Some of it is simply your genetic disposition, i.e. the relative composition of fast/slow twitch fibers.

I totally disagree that you can't get strong hangboaring for an hour a few times per week. I'm stronger than I've ever been, in my late 30s, by doing a month long hangboarding phase (session every third day, 8-10 total workouts) about 3-4 times a year, and NO other climbing during that phase. Hang sessions last maybe 20-25 min tops (using a slightly modded version of the Anderson bros hangboard routine). Volume doesn't really help that much in strength/recruitment training, and IME most people overtrain volume in that phase.

I follow the hangboard phase with 1-2 weeks focused on bouldering at my limit, 2-4 total workouts. Then a powerendurance phase for 2 weeks, then go send for a month. Then complete rest for 2 weeks or more, then some light climbing and general exercises for a week, then back into hangboard phase.

Power Endurance seems to "train up" faster than stamina or strength. With a couple weeks training it, I can basically max out my PE. The best things I've found for getting better power endurance are 50-70 move gym traverses at a level that you're pumped stupid at about move 60 (3-5 reps of that), 4x4s, and running back to back laps on stuff about a number below my RP limit, and doing overhanging system board laps where I reach failure around moves 50-70. A warmup, 4x4 workout, and cooldown should only take 1-1.5 hrs tops.

But the really important thing is the sequencing of the workouts *(periodization, essentially), proper rest, recovery, and nutrition, and sufficient cardio work. Core work also helps alot if you really do STRENGTH work on your core in addition to normal endurance stuff (e.g. 8 reps gravity boots situps with a 25lb plate across chest for strength vs 50 rep crunches enduro as a basic example, the point being that most people only do high rep core work that doesn't do much for ultimate strength)

Of course getting your head right, as Tony describes, can make huge differences in perceived endurance. Coordinating your breathing with your movement can help. Milking marginal rest stances and occasional downclimbing to a rest can also be good tactics.

And accept that your abilities will go up and down through the year as you go through the cycle.

RE: Self Coached Climber...it's a good resource, but is a much different approach than I take. Personally I don't think anyone has done much to up the ante on the old Goddard/Neuman book as far as content (from the early 90s!) and I think you can get as much from Mike's "Making of a Rock Prodigy" article describing his training as you can from either of those books...and it's free to boot.

Another good resource:

powercompanyclimbing.blogsp…

I have been bouldering in the gym for 30-50 minutes with out touching the ground... Make sure you don't pump out. Just stay right below the pump. Mainly stay on Medium holds and jugs. Practice shaking out and getting the blood back in your arms... Also BREATH!!!

Some of this will be repeated from what others have said already:

1)breathe -- some people tend to hold their breath while making hard moves. That's the exact opposite of what your muscles need. They need a constant supply of oxygen to keep working. Focus on calm, regular breathing while climbing.

2)do routes -- try to spend some gym time away from the bouldering area and get on some longer routes. Don't try to max your performance, just focus on staying on the wall for a long time.

3)traverse -- stay on the wall as long as you can. Again, don't worry about pulling hard moves, the point is to keep you on the wall, even if it's easy.

4)downclimb -- a lot of people drop from the top of the bouldering wall once they finish a problem. Try downclimbing it instead. You can track the problem you just did or traverse from the top and take a different route down. You could even link problems this way. Start on problem A. Finish it. Downclimb to the starting holds for problem B and start it without touching the ground. Again, don't try this at your highest grade limits. Jump down 1-2 grades.

5)laps -- already kind of mentioned in '4', but do laps on problems. Best bet would be to climb up, downclimb, and start the problem again without touching the ground. If this isn't workable, climb it, drop to the ground and get right back on it (or an easier problem).

Bottom line: if you are already strong but want to work endurance, drop whatever grade you're currently climbing by 1-2 and find ways to climb without getting off the wall for longer durations.

A lot of times what feels like a lack of endurance is actually a lack of technique. You climb tense, do not find rests, and flame out and blame your endurance. While it is true you can do lot's of exercises to increase your endurance, technique is learned by time on the rock.

Instead of trying things at your limit, focus on doing easier routes effortlessly. Then go back to the last hard route you sent and climb it a dozen times until it flows. Then go spend some time on your project, accept that it may be a year or two year goal. If you do this for a month and still feel like you have poor endurance then go subjugate yourself to gym drudgery....

Personally I do not feel that most climbing gym routes do much to teach you what you need to climb 5.12 granite trad routes. Granite is in general much more technical than either sandstone or limestone. It takes time to learn....