How does one go about Chopping Bolts?

I gained the info desired. Thanks.

Chopping is not really a good term.......many modern bolts you just unscrew with a wrench.....do some homework;..it's not too hard. If they can't be unscrewed....you usually pop them out with a piton behind the hanger and wedge them out....it can get messy. But think long and hard about your chopping choices. Often when bolts are "chopped"..they get put right back in....and this is very damaging to the rock when it gets to this point.... Also, when you "chop" a bolt, it more times then not, is taken as a personal attack on the people who put the bolts in;....in makes for very unfortunate and negetive human relations.....is that what you wish or are ready for, because it's probably gonna happen. It's only just a rock and a few pieces of metal...and there is rock all over , and bolts all over too. Is this really really such a horrible thing that these bolts were added?....or is it just that the "rules" of the game are not being followed to the tee?......I placed many bolts in my climbing career, and I enjoy the creative opportunities of doing the new route and all...but I have not enjoyed some of the grief and lost friendships that going along with bolt placing and removing......people are more important than rocks and metal......chopping bolts is 9 out of 10 times a bad idea....even if "you have every right", and "they were totally out of line"....yeah;...there is usually more to it than that....and , like I said before, it usually brings about some very negetive human interactions........my advice to you, respectfully speaking.......get over it, move along, have a beer, go climb a rock, and don't open up the pandora's box of bolt chopping demons and devils....Call me up if you wish to talk more on this;.....I have experience in this matter.....(760) 366-9395......

Todd,

Thanks for the reply. I enjoy clipping bolts as much as everyone else, but this case of "retro-bolting" irritates me. This route was put up by two local legends (names you'd recognize) in the late eighties at a remote crag that rarely sees traffic. It was BOLTED ON LEAD. It's also a stellar climb, at a crag that is often associated with bold run-outs and poor gear. That is the character of the climbs there, and I've enjoyed many personal "overcomings" there, as I'm sure countless others have. What right does some idividual with a bolt-kit have to change that experiance for future generations? Again, this is not a popular crag, a good hour at least from the road and most importantly it is a crag with history. I am not a good climber, and have backed off many a lead there, but it's the nature of the routes that draws me, and many others back, time and again.

There are just some things you never fuck with, and I think this route is one of them. Would the Bachar/Yarian be the Bachar/Yarian if it was retro-bolted with twice the number of bolts?

- And I do appreciate the information you provided in regards to removing a bolt - thank you.

Choppy choppy!

P Lando wrote:What right does some idividual with a bolt-kit have to change that experiance for future generations?

Funny. The same thing could be said about the first ascensionists, not just retrobolters. Except replace "change" with "dictate."

P Lando: Member Since Aug 21, 2010

Oh no, you guys are on to me. I'm just a troll at heart.

:)

Black or white, hispanic or jew, chances are you're an asshole too!

Not only that but it takes waaaayyy more mental control and conditioning to climb past a bolt without clipping it than it does to not clip one that aint there.

Grunt up a hard, runout route with crappy old bolts every 20 feet...? Eh.. sure that takes a set but a real badass can climb right past a perfectly good bolt and run it into X world. If you want to be reallly cool, blow off and smack the ground. Talk about have something to pound your chest over around the campfire later!

Good luck with your quest;.......hopefully the fallout is minimal;.....if you are irritated now by what the bolt villans have done to this historic route,.....you may get even more irritated when they react to your chopping.....yeah;.....they did a "bad" thing by adding these bolts to this historic route, and yeah...Bachar yerian should stay Bachar yerian......this we all know.....I just don't like the bad vibes associated with the chopping games;.....your irritation could increase.....when all you wanted was for the irritation to go away!....good luck, ...and I hope your plan works;....most of the time, it does NOT work the way you wish or plan....I know from experience......and yeah;.....you should have joined Mountain project years ago...instead of hours ago.....cheers. Todd Gordon

Tristan Higbee wrote: Funny. The same thing could be said about the first ascensionists, not just retrobolters. Except replace "change" with "dictate."

x2. You'd be a good lawyer Tristan - come join me in law college!

Tristan Higbee wrote: Funny. The same thing could be said about the first ascensionists, not just retrobolters. Except replace "change" with "dictate."

Thinking outside of the box, nice Tristan.

"What right does some idividual with a bolt-kit have to change that experiance for future generations?"

Tristan Higbee wrote: Funny. The same thing could be said about the first ascensionists, not just retrobolters. Except replace "change" with "dictate."

If you don't think the first ascent party has the right to "dictate" how a route is bolted than who does? Is it a committee? or someone playing God? It may not be perfect, but letting the FA party decide is in my opinion the best way. Would you like someone altering the bolts on your routes?

The bold routes in the Wasatch that have been put up by the Lowe's and others serve as mental test pieces. These climbs are good training for the high mountains, where you can't go dragging your power with you. Safe rap & drill routes are a dime a dozen. Routes that are more runnout adventures are rare these days...please respect these old school classics.

TP in SLC wrote: Well put Brian. And yes the FA does dictate where the bolts go, it's been part of the "game" for years. Lots of little turds these days just want it "their" way. I got an idea (one that has been beaten like a dead horse) sack up or take up tennis, not every route is for everybody. Nor should it be brought down so "everybody" can climb it. That mentality drives me nutz.

DITTO!

If you have to ask how to chop bolts, you shouldn't do it.

The instant you alter a bolt, you are putting others' lives in your hands. Don't fuck it up.

bsmoot wrote:"What right does some idividual with a bolt-kit have to change that experiance for future generations?" If you don't think the first ascent party has the right to "dictate" how a route is bolted than who does? Is it a committee? or someone playing God? It may not be perfect, but letting the FA party decide is in my opinion the best way. Would you like someone altering the bolts on your routes? The bold routes in the Wasatch that have been put up by the Lowe's and others serve as mental test pieces. These climbs are good training for the high mountains, where you can't go dragging your power with you. Safe rap & drill routes are a dime a dozen. Routes that are more runnout adventures are rare these days...please respect these old school classics.

I was mostly just playing devil's advocate. I wasn't saying that the FA shouldn't dictate where bolts go, I just think people need to relax and realize that there is no one right way of doing things. I do NOT think routes should be retrobolted, because the community consensus is not to. But I can understand why some people would want to do it.

I smile whenever someone says "I'm gonna chop me some bolts!" or "I'm gonna add me some bolts!" There are extremists on both sides and we can all talk about it to death but at the end of the day, some pissed off individual is going to go out and do whatever the hell they want, regardless of what some wankers on a forum think.

Would I mind if someone added bolts to my routes? No. Not really. And for a lot of my routes, chopping bolts is way more work than it's worth, so have at it.

And sure, lots of "little turds" out there want it their way, but so do lots of "old farts"! Whatever. Regardless of what you do, someone's going to be up in arms about it. Can't make everyone happy.

Why would you want to waste your time chopping bolts? We're only going to replace them. If you insist on chopping bolts, you'd better do it on the lead.

mountainproject.com/v/color…

Chop all bolts.....replace with pitons! That way you get the TRUE oldschool experience! Also hemp ropes and no carabiners = badass.

just imagine if a bunch of kooks cruised around joshua tree, and decided to bolt up illusion dweller, or slap a few more on loose lady, or the south west face of Headstone. The thought makes me cringe.

To answer the original question,
Use a 1/2" drive breaker bar with a socket and tighten until the head twists off.

Don't chop, erase. Addressing the mechanics of the process . . . It's unfortunate that some folks first attempt to saw through the stud (chopping). Start by using some old blue jeans or a piece of denim or other tough fabric to protect the rock around the bolt to be removed. If the bolt does not have a hangar, you will need to add one. Using a flat bar and a hammer, with the fabric protecting the rock carefully tap the flat bar underneath the hangar. Continue to tap and pry until the bolt comes out. If for some reason the bolt refuses to come all of the way out, THEN saw the stud carefully as close to the rock as you can, and use a punch to tap/countersink the remains of the stud back into the hole. Use some epoxy and rock dust of the same color to fill the hole so that it is invisible to the casual observer.